rworegon

I'm ready!! If they don't, Fedex does.
Enjoy the snow day tomorrow!

rworegon

Take a look at our Snow Water Equivalent % through Jan. 4. I'm right where the 24 is on the Oregon/Washington border. The red is depressing.

ftp://ftp.wcc.nrcs.usda.gov/data/wat...mal_update.pdf

habanero

Oof! Hope that turns around Rw! Trying to fit all this snow in Express mail box now....

rworegon

Thanks! It generally catches up at some point as we can get mountain snow through May. Charlie's lovin' it!

hrt4me

No thanks! Makes me want to move even further south now...

I finally got that upper starter bolt loose via an extended socket and my breaker bar, and I was able by hand to unclip that small black connector and pry off the gray plastic cover from the positive wire... I worked into the night and cold and got it all done, so I hope my intermittent starting issues are now a thing of the past!

Anyway, I don't want to clutter up your build/maintenance thread, habanero, but I took a lot of photos along the way and would be willing to post them here if you give the okay because you think it might help others who also happen to own '96 SR5 5-speed manual V6 4WD 4Runners...

habanero

Hrt4me, if you want to post pics here you go on ahead. I was looking for pics of the starter contacts I had taken in 08 but couldn't find them. I don't even have pics of the actual starter fix to post so no worry of redundancy. Why not? Heck, I've got pics of the dog in a sleeping bag, if you want to talk about clutter.

It's -7 and still dropping, with 30-35mph winds, I think I heard the weather guy say something like -28 windchill. I'm just going to thank my lucky stars I'm not further north and in a nice warm house with hot coffee.

Hope everyone is warm and comfortable and AVI- please take your weather back!!!

rworegon

Feets deep snow now??? ;-)

habanero

Got about a foot. -7 this morning and something like that again tomorrow morning. Still lots of snow on the road too. At least the winds have tuned down a bit. Another day off school tomorrow, because of the below 0 temp and the snow. At least it'll get up to 21-ish tomorrow so I'll be able to shoo the kid outside.

PS. I got the snow into the box but it escaped. All it left behind was a soggy falling apart bunch of cardboard. I've been looking all over the house for it but so far no luck.

hrt4me

Ever since I bought my '96 SR5 V6 5-speed 4WD (with rear E-locker) in September 2012, I occasionally experienced a click when turning the key in the ignition to start my 4Runner. I thought it was just because I did not have the clutch pressed in all the way, so whenever I readjusted and moved my body further forward and tried again, it started up right away on the second try. It never occurred to me that my starter was going out until that click happened more frequently, and/or I had to turn the key in the ignition more than one additional time to start my 4Runner.

The final straw happened three (3) weeks ago, when I first experienced the click, moved forward closer to the clutch and turned the key in the ignition again. That time, my 4Runner started up but then the starter continued to try to "start" while the engine was already running. Moreover, when I tried to shut off the engine by turning the key in the ignition to the OFF position (and even removing the key from the ignition entirely), the starter kept trying to "start" the engine. I purposely re-started the engine and eventually the starter just quit trying to "start"; I had never before experienced anything like that!

So I began researching all the various starter repair threads I could find and learned I most likely only needed to replace both the starter contacts, as well as possibly the plunger itself, dependent upon what I found when I opened up the starter. After thoroughly reading Starter Contacts Removal (without removing starter), I decided to tackle this project myself; I ordered the starter contacts from Roger Brown, a.k.a. 4Crawler, and bought the plunger directly from Toyota of Dallas, which happens to be only 3 miles from my office.

In hindsight, I could have saved almost $30 and probably just used a generic Nippon Denso starter repair kit, which I've seen online for less than $10, rather than paying dealer price for the plunger (which I wasn't sure I'd need, but I wanted to have on hand just in case - I could always return it in the event I ended up not using it)...

Comarc's above-referenced DIY write-up was pretty easy to follow, but I got stuck temporarily trying to loosen the top starter bolt, as well as trying to unclip the small black connector and remove the gray plastic cover from the positive (+) battery cable. I eventually prevailed, loosening the upper starter bolt with my breaker bar and an extended socket I had to go buy, and just prying off the gray plastic cover and unclipping the small black connector by hand, all from underneath my 4Runner with the rear skid plate removed. I finally got the starter completely unbolted from the engine (in the following photo, you can see the starter bolts still in place through the engine):

and dropped down from the engine, resting on the steering rack so I could unbolt the three (3) 7mm cover bolts. I had initially planned to simply replace both the contacts right there in place, until I opened the cover and saw how dirty the inner housing was:



I removed the plunger and spring; you can see how filthy the old plunger was:


and this next photo depicts how worn & pitted the copper disc on the plunger was:


for comparison, here is the old plunger and the new replacement plunger (now I was glad I had the foresight to buy one to have on hand, just in case):


finally, this next photo depicts the old plunger after I cleaned it by simply wiping off all the crud built up on it:


In my research, I had found Dave's Denso starter contact replacement thread on the ExPo forums, which helped explain why my starter had kept trying to start the one time, both when the engine was already running, as well as when the engine was off with the key removed from the ignition. According to Dave, my starter contacts had gotten pitted and worn down to the point such that when the starter engaged, the plunger stuck between the channels dug out of the contacts, keeping the starter engaged, even when I removed the key from the ignition; Dave went on to further explain there was full battery amperage going through the motor, and so when that happened, I risk my 4Runner catching fire! BTW, Dave's particular thread was furthermore a great reference for all the proper torque specs (stud nuts and cover bolts), as well as the piece of steel which Dave machined to apply force to both the starter contacts while properly torquing down the 14mm stud nuts on the outside of the housing.

So once I unbolted the starter from the engine, dropped it down to the steering rack, unbolted the cover, saw how dirty the inner housing was, and realized I could simply wipe all that crud from the plunger, I decided to completely remove the starter so I could thoroughly clean it on the bench, as well as properly torque all the nuts to spec.

I took a break and went back inside to research again how to actually remove the starter itself. I found THIS THREAD describing several approaches and figured I could make at least one of them work, but I also found THIS THREAD, which sounded a whole lot easier than trying to wiggle and orient the heavy starter through a maze of vehicle components. So I ended up simply unbolting the front sway bar mounting brackets (2 bolts and 2 nuts/washers on each side), and I was able to ease the starter right out past the steering rack from underneath my 4Runner; here is the starter completely out of the 4Runner:



I had reinstalled the cover to prevent damaging anything during removal, so I unbolted the cover again; it looked relatively clean, and I easily wiped off the crud from its inner portion:


This next photo again shows how dirty the inner housing was:


I unbolted the starter contact on the battery side:


here is the new versus the old starter contact from the battery side:


and a close-up showing how the old starter contact (battery side) was pitted and worn:


this next photo shows the inner housing with the starter contact removed from the battery side; you can see how much crud was built up in there, compared to where the contact used to be:


this is the starter contact removed from the motor side:


and a close-up, again showing the pitting and wear on the starter contact from the motor side:


I used cotton swabs and brake cleaner to thoroughly wipe and clean the inner housing:


and here is the finished result, a clean inner housing awaiting new parts (starter contacts and plunger):


here are the parts ready to bolt back into the housing (everything except the plunger spring):


and here are all those parts bolted back into the starter housing and properly torqued to specifications (I followed Dave's advice and used a large socket to apply force on both starter contacts as I torqued the 14mm nuts on the outside of the housing):


By the time I cleaned the inside of the housing and replaced the worn plunger & both contacts and bolted on the cover and torqued the three (3) 7mm bolts, I tried to slide the starter back in place from underneath the 4Runner, past the front sway bar and steering rack, the opposite way I had taken it out. I could just not, however, recall exactly how it came out, and I was unable to properly orient it for installation... and it was getting heavy lying under the 4Runner! So I ended up getting the starter back in place via the passenger wheel well; I had already previously unbolted the two (2) 12mm bolts which keep the brake line in place on both the outside and inside of the frame (based on THIS THREAD, whose instructions I had initially followed anyway), and it turned out to be very easy to maneuver the starter back in place that way. I read elsewhere that the starter is easier to remove on the 4Runners with 5-speed manual transmissions compared to those with automatic transmissions.

Anyway, now my starter starts right up again, and so I hope my intermittent starter issues (clicking, and one time recently, the starter still attempted to start both when the engine was already running, as well as when I tried to shut off the engine and removed the key from the ignition!) are a thing of the past... only time will tell whether or not I did a good job...

hrt4me

I meant to throw in the Toyota part numbers to help others in the future:

Each engine has one of two different starters, they are usually marked with either the part number or the kw.

2.7L (1.4kw) starter P/N: 28100-0C010-84 (non-cold spec)
2.7L (1.8kw) starter P/N: 28100-75140-84 (cold spec)

(Required) Contact P/N: 28226-74070
(Required) Contact P/N (non-cold spec): 28226-54340 or Contact P/N (cold spec): 28226-22050
(Recommended) Plunger P/N: 28235-54380
(Optional, if needed) Clutch P/N: 28011-26042

3.4L (1.4kw) starter P/N: 28100-07010-84 (non-cold spec)
3.4L (1.8kw) starter P/N: 28100-62030-84 (cold spec)

(Required) Contact P/N: 28226-74070
(Required) Contact P/N (non-cold spec): 28226-16130 or Contact P/N (cold spec): 28226-54340
(Recommended) Plunger P/N: 28235-55050 (non-cold spec) 28235-54380 (cold spec)
(Optional, if needed) Clutch P/N: 28011-26042

aviator

Good info Hrt... personally when my starter starts to act up I usually just pull it and throw in a replacement rebuild unit... there are a couple of shops near me that do excellent work and always have one or two in stock...

No hab I don't wanna take back my weather but it's coming this way all on it's own... it's currently 56F in my meat locker and that's up 2 from me sitting beside the thermometer with the computer turned on... the heat balancing in the house sucks... rest of the house is closer to 65F... i don't mind the cold or snow but it would have been nice if people had cleared the snow properly from their sidewalks before the ice rain came and turned it all into a sheet of thick ice... almost broke my neck several times last night walking...

habanero

WOW Hrt4me!!! That is a terrific write-up!!! Thanks for posting it here, I'm going to put it in the table of contents with credit to you- you certainly deserve it! If you ever get a build thread going it's going to be a nice one.

habanero

Avi, it's -10 this morning. Take it back take it back take it back!!! It's hard work to be a delicate hothouse flower in all your Canadian air.

An indoor temp of 56F is long undie cold. How ever do you type with gloves on???

hrt4me

thanks for the credit

I have to ask, though, whether it is difficult to type while wearing gloves or mittens (you must be freezing up there in cold Misery - I mean Missouri)...?

habanero

It's record cold. One of the people on the news this morning showed a shot of her car dash reading -19. The weatherman confirmed that it was true, she lives a little further out. We went out after it got up to 5 degrees and blew bubbles. It was too late though, so only a few froze. Later on it got up in the low 20s so we spent 4 hours in the driveway working on a science fair project. I put the kid in the 4Runnner and ran it every once in awhile to keep him warm while he was keeping time and writing notes and results. The nature of the project requires an adult to do the actual dirty work. It's the first time the truck's moved since Sunday.
We have a snow day again tomorrow- and a chance for snow tomorrow night. I'm getting a little
ssssstttttiiiirrrrrr ccccccrrrrrrraaaaaazzzzzzzyyyyy yy y yyyy yyy yy y yy...

rworegon

Just a little???????? You guys will have forgotten what work and school is there pretty quick. We are a balmy +33.5f here and a bit of rain is all today.

What's the project? How fast the rig cools off in very cold air temperatures? hmmm....

aviator

I'm Canadian I'm sitting here typing in my T shirt and lounge pants... warmer weather is coming soon habsie stay strong...

habanero

Rub it in guys, just rub it in. High of 33 today, light snow tonight, we might actually have school tomorrow.

I'm not allowed to say what the project is until after science fair is over. I don't know if he thinks it jinxes it or what but either way, I'll share later.

One of the antifreeze leaks on the 96 was indeed a slightly loose hose. Found another that I'm a little more worried about, seems to be coming from somewhere on the front of the engine. It is a very small leak (so far). I didn't lay down in the snow to figure it out yesterday. There is a bearing-y noise, but I think that's still just the alternator and not an additional noise. I'll have to clear some snow and get down where I can see.

rworegon

Ah, yes, I remember asking about the project last year too. He's smart as the competition may be scoping mom's thread for project clues.

If you can't find the leak, a quick pressure test on the cooling system may help. Have a great day and happy leak hunting.

aviator

Good luck at the science fair...