Bypass the OE tranny cooler?
04-07-2010 | 11:45 AM
#201
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From: SLC, UT
I know we discussed this once before, but I can't remember if we talked about you thinking these temps are too high for synthetic ATF or are you running non-synthetic ATF?
IMHO, I never thought of those temps (180-200* F) as being too hot. Keep in mind Toyota engineers set the "too hot" idiot light to come on at over 300* F and go off at around 250*. Unless you are trying to make the ATF last 100,000 miles or something I don't see a problem with those temps (180-200 F), especially with good synthetic ATF. Maybe I'm wrong.
EDIT: For reference I'm taking about temps measured in the tranny output line on the way to the cooler. Very different than say tranny pan temps (see link in my post below).
But that a side, I'm all for the extra cooling though, and if the thicker B&M fits in the space I'd definitely try it next time I'm looking for a cooler. No way would it fit where I put mine (along with a fan too). But I put mine in a strange place. That or just a bigger model of the thin type or even 2 coolers in series.
I do think air flow is even more important with the thicker coolers. I think 2 thin coolers would "out-cool" one thick one (of the same size) in just about every situation given the same air flow. I do have 2 thick coolers on my truck, one is an oil cooler and one is an auxiliary radiator.
IMHO, I never thought of those temps (180-200* F) as being too hot. Keep in mind Toyota engineers set the "too hot" idiot light to come on at over 300* F and go off at around 250*. Unless you are trying to make the ATF last 100,000 miles or something I don't see a problem with those temps (180-200 F), especially with good synthetic ATF. Maybe I'm wrong.
EDIT: For reference I'm taking about temps measured in the tranny output line on the way to the cooler. Very different than say tranny pan temps (see link in my post below).But that a side, I'm all for the extra cooling though, and if the thicker B&M fits in the space I'd definitely try it next time I'm looking for a cooler. No way would it fit where I put mine (along with a fan too). But I put mine in a strange place. That or just a bigger model of the thin type or even 2 coolers in series.
I do think air flow is even more important with the thicker coolers. I think 2 thin coolers would "out-cool" one thick one (of the same size) in just about every situation given the same air flow. I do have 2 thick coolers on my truck, one is an oil cooler and one is an auxiliary radiator.
04-07-2010 | 12:01 PM
#202
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From: Oklahoma State
04-07-2010 | 10:38 PM
#204
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It depends on what gauge you use, I'm using this electric Isspro gauge: http://www.egauges.com/vdo_mult3.asp...=EVA_R&Units=E and yes it needs power. If I had it to do over I'd probably go with a Scangauge II in place of lots of my gauges. Mechanical gauges I guess don't need power except to light them up at night.
I didn't install a gauge, and now I'm horribly curious what my temps are with a the B&M 70268 (exact same size at Tru-Cool 4454).
I have absolutely no experience with Scangauge products. Did I pick up on the fact that it's NOT quite as simple as buying one and plugging it in? Do you need a special firmware update or code or something for it to read Toyota's trans temp?
04-07-2010 | 11:13 PM
#205
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 434
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From: Galveston, Texas
No for the Scan Gauge II (has to be the newer scan gauge) to see the transmission temp, all you have to do is program one of the "x gauges" with the address of data the transmission temp is. So its nothing more than pushing a few buttons.
FOG
FOG
04-08-2010 | 06:05 AM
#206
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From: Oklahoma State
Here's some more info on that: http://www.scangauge.com/support/xgauge.shtml
It looks like they still call it a Scangauge II but the newer ones have the xgauge feature. I don't know why they didn't just call it the Scangauge III
It looks like they still call it a Scangauge II but the newer ones have the xgauge feature. I don't know why they didn't just call it the Scangauge III
Last edited by mt_goat; 04-08-2010 at 08:39 AM.
04-08-2010 | 08:21 AM
#207
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 470
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From: Kenai, Alaska
Here's some more info on that: http://www.scangauge.com/support/xgauge.shtml
TXD: 686AF101B4
RXF: 044105B40000
RXD: 2808
MTH: 00090005FFD8
NAM: Anything you want
I'm running it on mine. I just hit over 170* last weekend going up a mountain road. That's the hightest it's been, but one, I haven't monitored it for long, and two it's still pretty cool temps up here (40-50*).
Running the Tru-Cool by the way...
04-08-2010 | 08:34 AM
#208
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From: Oklahoma State
Scangauge data to input for tranny temps:
TXD: 686AF101B4
RXF: 044105B40000
RXD: 2808
MTH: 00090005FFD8
NAM: Anything you want
I'm running it on mine. I just hit over 170* last weekend going up a mountain road. That's the hightest it's been, but one, I haven't monitored it for long, and two it's still pretty cool temps up here (40-50*).
Running the Tru-Cool by the way...
TXD: 686AF101B4
RXF: 044105B40000
RXD: 2808
MTH: 00090005FFD8
NAM: Anything you want
I'm running it on mine. I just hit over 170* last weekend going up a mountain road. That's the hightest it's been, but one, I haven't monitored it for long, and two it's still pretty cool temps up here (40-50*).
Running the Tru-Cool by the way...
Last edited by mt_goat; 04-08-2010 at 08:54 AM.
04-08-2010 | 02:16 PM
#210
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Joined: Feb 2009
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From: Atlantic City, NJ
So, I have gone 181000 mi on my original radiator setup. 
I had a small leak (just coolant) after a minor fender bender and put some stop leak in it. After reading the last 9 pages (yes I read them all) I am now fully aware that I am driving a time bomb around. 
I am sure the jarring from the accident didnt help. But as of 5 min ago, no milkshake. 
I had a small leak (just coolant) after a minor fender bender and put some stop leak in it. After reading the last 9 pages (yes I read them all) I am now fully aware that I am driving a time bomb around. I am sure the jarring from the accident didnt help. But as of 5 min ago, no milkshake.
04-08-2010 | 03:08 PM
#211
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From: TX
Just out of curiousity has anyone done a write up on this since its such a common occurence? I mean its fun to read thru 21 pages of info but a more comprehensive write up would help greatly if there isnt one up already.
04-08-2010 | 04:42 PM
#212
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From: Oklahoma State
There are lots of write ups on installing an extra ATF cooler, guys have been doing that for many years. Bypassing is that plus just adding on this step covered in post #19 on this thread: https://www.yotatech.com/50642797-post19.html
04-08-2010 | 07:47 PM
#213
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 434
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From: Galveston, Texas
IMHO, I never thought of those temps (180-200* F) as being too hot. Keep in mind Toyota engineers set the "too hot" idiot light to come on at over 300* F and go off at around 250*. Unless you are trying to make the ATF last 100,000 miles or something I don't see a problem with those temps (180-200 F), especially with good synthetic ATF.
My main reason for wanting to keep the transmission as cool as possible is to leave allot of margin to tolerate events that generate allot of heat.
Example being if your transmission is already running around 180F and your towing a trailer and come to a decent grade to climb. By the time you get to the top you have added 30 degrees of heat and are now around 210F and that's a conservative estimate.
By keeping my transmission as cool as possible I may start the hill climb at 140-150F and by the time I'm at the top I'm only at 170-180F.
I just look at it as the lower I keep it on average the less the peak temps will be under hard load events. And really ATF only needs to be 100F to function properly so any heat above that is really unnecessary.
But that's just my mindless ramblings and your mileage my vary.
FOG
04-09-2010 | 12:28 AM
#214
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Joined: Sep 2009
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From: Sunny San Diego
So maybe it's safe to say that:
if you're planning on towing, you should get a cooler with a higher capacity and if you just plan on cruising on highways then a 4454 will do fine.
of course consider the variables that affect the effectiveness of your cooler (e.g. location, mounting)
Can we all agree on this?
of course if you really want to keep it cool down there, then go for the bigger and thicker cooler.
and btw the xgauge codes up there only works for 99 and above models of the t4r. not for 96-98
if you're planning on towing, you should get a cooler with a higher capacity and if you just plan on cruising on highways then a 4454 will do fine.
of course consider the variables that affect the effectiveness of your cooler (e.g. location, mounting)
Can we all agree on this?
of course if you really want to keep it cool down there, then go for the bigger and thicker cooler.
and btw the xgauge codes up there only works for 99 and above models of the t4r. not for 96-98
04-09-2010 | 06:04 AM
#215
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Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Oklahoma State
So maybe it's safe to say that:
if you're planning on towing, you should get a cooler with a higher capacity and if you just plan on cruising on highways then a 4454 will do fine.
of course consider the variables that affect the effectiveness of your cooler (e.g. location, mounting)
Can we all agree on this?
of course if you really want to keep it cool down there, then go for the bigger and thicker cooler.
and btw the xgauge codes up there only works for 99 and above models of the t4r. not for 96-98
if you're planning on towing, you should get a cooler with a higher capacity and if you just plan on cruising on highways then a 4454 will do fine.
of course consider the variables that affect the effectiveness of your cooler (e.g. location, mounting)
Can we all agree on this?
of course if you really want to keep it cool down there, then go for the bigger and thicker cooler.
and btw the xgauge codes up there only works for 99 and above models of the t4r. not for 96-98
Do you know what year of Tacomas the xguage codes work for?
Last edited by mt_goat; 04-09-2010 at 06:38 AM.
04-09-2010 | 07:46 AM
#216
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 434
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From: Galveston, Texas
If you drive in any of the following situations the 4454 is too small
1.Trailer towing
2.Stop and going driving in summer temps at or above 90F (almost all of the southern states)
3.Steep Grades IE Mountain Driving (Colorado, Montana, Wyoming, ETC)
4.Off roading especially in mud or sand which cause the torque converter to build up allot of heat. Also because of the slow speeds of off road driving the lack of airflow makes the transmission coolers overall size and efficiency more important.
FOG
Last edited by FogRunner; 04-09-2010 at 07:48 AM.
04-09-2010 | 08:12 AM
#218
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 434
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From: Galveston, Texas
I tow ALLOT between my utility trailer which ways in a 4-6K total or my always in the shop boat which is in the 4-5K range. Add to that I live in Houston so I see allot of stop and go driving while in 90F+ temps allot. I also go wheeling in the sand on the beach in those 90F summer days.
All of which isn't easy service on a transmission, but I keep my transmission in the 125-130F range unloaded and the 175F range when towing.
I'm about to roll over 300,000 miles with zero transmission problems even with all the abuse I give it.
But as stated on the sales receipt, YMMV.
FOG
04-09-2010 | 08:46 AM
#219
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From: Oklahoma State
Dang that is a hard load FOG, and equally great results. I appreciate and value your input as I'm sure others do, as I've said before you are a true asset to YT.
I've noticed we see eye to eye on most things, so I'd safely say we can agree on this. If not, correct me.
ATF temps 160-180* F are better than 180-200* F, and certainly better than 200-220* F and above.
It's better to monitor ATF temps than to not monitor them, and it better to monitor at the hottest location in the ATF cycle so you know the hottest the ATF is getting.
Synthetic ATF can withstand more heat than non-synthetic ATF.
And YMMV.
I've noticed we see eye to eye on most things, so I'd safely say we can agree on this. If not, correct me.
ATF temps 160-180* F are better than 180-200* F, and certainly better than 200-220* F and above.
It's better to monitor ATF temps than to not monitor them, and it better to monitor at the hottest location in the ATF cycle so you know the hottest the ATF is getting.
Synthetic ATF can withstand more heat than non-synthetic ATF.
And YMMV.
04-09-2010 | 09:42 PM
#220
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 129
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From: Sunny San Diego
Sorry goat but i have no idea what year the xgauge code work? All I know is that they don't work for the 96-98 t4rs.
But it still is a pretty useful thing, i've helped a lot of friends with their check engine lights or when they're buying a used car. I also use it to closely monitor my water temp as my radiator is 13 years old.
But it still is a pretty useful thing, i've helped a lot of friends with their check engine lights or when they're buying a used car. I also use it to closely monitor my water temp as my radiator is 13 years old.
