Memphis4X4

Oh BTW.....Dr Z, if I lived near you, I'd jump at the chance to Dyno my Runner! $55 is a great price for 3 passes. I paid around $100 dyno-ing my car!!!

David

WATRD

Well, I beleive that the difference is that on carburated engines, the air/fuel mix is created in the carburator and travels through the intake in that form. In FI type engines, the air is regulated, then fuel is injected at the last possible moment as the air enters the combustion chamber. That leaves a pretty fair amount of travel room for the water to re-condense.

So, in a carburated engine, the mix gets dumped directly into the engine. With FI, there are more places for the water to become deposited and to pool as the air goes along it's merry way toward the injectors. The resonator boxes give this moisture a place to collect, then be turned into harmless vapor by engine heat, instead of being carried along as droplets or being deposited in someplace where it can have a bad effect.

I have no scientific evidence to back this up, but it's what I have been told and it seems reasonable.

Adam F

Is there anything wrong with using the dryer hose as a permanant peice, instead of going to a muffler shop and having them bend up a pipe? Or maybe some sort of flexible rubber hose? I'm not concerned about appearance.

MonkeyElvis

Im also looking into this mod, but a little concerned about what effect it will have on my emissions testing and so on. The other concern was the possibility of getting water into the system by removing these parts, and while i was browsing a site, i found these http://store.yahoo.com/racinglab/aemairbypval.html which say that they would restrict any water or moisture that comes past the air filter and they come in 3" diameter so i was wondering if you thought something like this would be worthwhile, or if its just hype. thanks for any information!

WATRD

I don't think that is going to help you out... It is designed to prevent the catastrophic ingestion of water as would happen just before you hydrolock. It won't really come into play with smaller amounts of water.

It's cool to see that they are making those commercially. When I was a Jeeper, one of the hot mods was to build one of those using a ping-pong ball trapped in PVC. Your engine would breath normally until the ball was floated by enough water. Once the ball floated, it blocked off the normal intake and breathed through a smaller, snorkel like intake until the water pressure was removed. Their method looks much cleaner

Dandeman

I found even the deckplate mod to increase intake sound higher than I wanted on partial throttle (sorry OD'ed from too much exposure to no air cleaners on carburetors in high school :confused: :confused: )

So added this to my deck plate mod to lower the noise level.. Don't feel any effect on power level.. It blocks off direct line of sight from the engine to the deckplate opening and knocks the noise level down.. It's just a rubber sanding disc backing pad which was the perfect size..

It was mounted on an adjustable screw so I could close it down further if needed, but it knocks the sound down enough positioned as it is.

williemon

I wonder what would happen if instead of a properly sized tube in place of the little boxes, if one big box with no restrictive internal baffles were used? Still have line of sight for airflow, but now there is a place for condensation to collect. Just a thought. A couple more thoughts, I wonder if moisture would be more an issue in a wet climate than in a dry one? Also, fuel injected marine engines I think just pass the air through a spark arrestior with no filter or moisture collection boxes. I know thats how My carbed 3.0 in my boat does it. Maybe the boxes on the Yota intakes have more to do with large chunks of water as when found when wheeling rather than with the moisture in the air? I will look some more, but I did find reference somewhere that the boxes served as not only a muffler, but as an intake length tuner. I think there was a reference to some 2 stroke engines as well. Kind of like as an exhaust pulse exits the tailpipe, there is a vacume pulse sent up toward the engine in the pipe and it travels up to the exhaust valves, into the cylinder, out the intake valve, through the intake plenum, out the throttle body and out the intake element. As it travels, it affects things like how the exhaust is pulled out the cylinder, how the fuel/air charge is pulled into the cylinder, and how air is pulled in through the filter element, throttle body and plenum. Like I said, a ref. to 2 stroke engines was in this also but I got the impression that with a 2 stroke, this is the main way to tune it for max power, but that it also affects 4 strokes in much the same way, maybe not as much. Ok, I enjoyed that. Just had to get that out. There. I feel better now. Thanks a bunch.

Corey

iTrader: (1)

It does get a little confusing on the water issue.
I use to intentionally shoot water into my '68 Chevelle with a 327 in it.

My dad & I hooked up a Holly water injection unit that shot water right into the carb when called for.

That was a long time ago, so I can't remember all the details of it.
It was suppose to improve power, and prevent detonation I think when you got on it.
Corey

WATRD

Wasn't water injection fun? I ran water injection on my Mustang, then converted it to alcohol We have a few Tacoma folk who are experimenting with both water injection and alcohol injection for their 3.4L V6's. We also have a few playing with teflon S/C gaskets and onboard intercoolers Fun stuff.

Keep in mind that water injection uses jets designed to deliver a carefully measured amount of aspirated water at a planned location in the intake. It's not the same as droplets of water being loose at random loactions in the intake

Gadget

Corey, well done!!!

I do see one thing you may want to do different, well maybe two...

First, those nuts on the inside of the tube, bad idea. First it will cause drag, and second, if one of those suckers gets loose, well you will need a new engine....

Get nuts the same size as those and have them welded to the outside of the tube and just have a hole going in. That way it is never going to come off and you will retain the smooth interior of the tube.

Now that you have the pipe done, take it off and put your old stuff back on. Then ship your pipe to a place that does Mandrel Pipe bending so they can duplicate it with their Mandrel Bending machine. That way it will stay the same diameter all the way through and not get the diameter reduced where the bend is. I am sure they have a couple of those machines around the Boeing plant and might be able to do you one is slick aluminum and tig weld on a couple of nuts for you at the same time.

You will be suprised how much of a flow loss there is in that bend restiction.

Then when you get it back you can make sure it fits and then have a bunch made up and market them to your buds at the "Corey Pipe"...

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com

Corey

iTrader: (1)

Hi Gadget, I think you are confusing me with the other Corey
I formatted the article and put it up, but it was "Blu" (the other Corey) who actually did this mod.

That is a good idea though on the nuts. I was thinking the same thing if one of them came loose.
Ouch...

Maybe Blu will see the post here and get that done, then I can revamp his artilce.
That is a good safety idea though to have the nuts tacked to the outside of the tube.
Corey

Adam F

I think if you go to all the trouble of getting it mandrel bent and welded up kind of defeats the whole purpose of this mod, at least for me. It's supposed to be a cheaper alternative to the K&N type thing. After it being shipped off to a mandrel bender, welding, and so fourth it wouldnt be such a good deal. Know what I mean?

BTOWN4RUNNER

If you want to keep the nuts, you should maybe put some loctite on them, so they will not get loose. The only thing that I may think is that the "smell" might mess something up. Like why you have to use sensor safe sealant. Just an option though. :fireman:

thundercat

i've been working on the silencer removal mod for my 92 runner, and had a piece of pipe bent up at a muffler shop. it fits perfecty between the intake and air box, but i am concerned about how close it is to the master cylinder. with engine rock and vibrations, doesn't the pipe pose a risk of cracking the cylinder casing? it looks like it's cast aluminum, which won't stand much of a chance against a steel pipe.

1Runner

OK guys... here it is! I just finished this mod on my 3.0 tonight. To tell it straidgt, I had aF*@#^ of a time finding the brass fittings here. (pretty rural where I live) The 3" muffler pipe IS THE WAY TO GO!! and I'll tell ya why. You can either JB weld the fittings in, or braze them in. The prob. is, standard hardware (nuts&bolts) are a different size than plumbing and hydraulic hardware. Dont believe me?? You soon will. Try to get the parts to jive!
ANYHOO!! To make this short... Focus on finding a fitting that will make a snug fit on your hoses that you have to move, dont worry about nuts, "o" rings and washers. Drill holes to fit the fittings where you want them to hook up, and braze those bad boys in. Clean it up, make it pretty(it is going on a toyota after all) and spray it flt blk. Wish I had pics for you, but we dont have a digi camera yet.
Does it make a HUGE difference? NO.... But, my engine IS breathing easier. That much is obvious. I'm going on a fishing trip in 2 weeks and want to hold off on comments til then. I'm gonna check my mileage on the trip.

1Runner

Sorry guys.... I forgot to add, it cost me 18 bucks. The guy at the muff. shop gave me the pipe.
You MAY be able to use a 2.5" PVC 45 deg. elbow, but Im not sure. Problem is, the PVC has about a full 1/4 in thick wall.
Know any commercial electricians??? If they have a "hot-box" they can bend PVC. BUT, 3" exh. pipe is the way to go.

Skydigger

I'd like to hear Corey (Blu's) update now that it's been a couple of months. Anyone else?


Warren

ohio

I've enver done any engine mods, but I did an awful lot of experimental fluids work as an engineer, and have a thought about fixing the theoretical turbulelence problems.

On several of the devices I built we needed extremely smooth air flow or fluid flow. To accomplish this we would build a chamber inline with the flow packed with standard plastic drinking straws (for air we used the smallest we could find, for water normal size was fine). Orientation was so that the air was flowing through the straws, not around them, if that makes sense. They had very little resistance and were extremely effective in smoothing flow directionally. Water flow out of our jets was so smooth it looked like glass... not a ripple.

They will have more resistance than an open path, especially when you factor in a screen to contain the straws, but turbulence causes resistance also, so it might cancel out or close to.

Added benefit is that HDPE (the plastic used in most straws) is a very damp material, so it might act as a mild silencer, but with much less resistance than the standard baffled version.

thundercat

well, i finished the silencer removal mod on my 92 runner! i modified the design a little bit by cutting the pipe i had bent in half, and then using the oem hose that connects to the intake by turning it on its side and attatching that to the pipe with a clamp. that way i only had to mount one nozzle instead of two, and it gives the whole piece a little bit more flex. i am really excited about it. i think it made quite a bit of difference in acceleration, could be in my head though! but i think there are, in fact, a couple more ponies helping me along, and that's with a crappy air filter! i will have to pick up an amsoil before i take it down to tucson this weekend for some action. thanks, blu, for the great idea!

Corey

iTrader: (1)

Lets see a pic of that new tube you made.
I'd still like to do this mod too my rig.

Amsoil does not make a filter though for the 3.0.
We tried to get them to do it.
There is a huge post from several months ago where we had a contact there, and they were going to try and make us one, but it fell through.

What did you do with the other hose that attaches?
Some where concerned with the nut inside coming off and getting sucked into the TB, which would spell a nuclear metldown of the engine.
Corey