Wreck with a 3" body lift
06-10-2011, 11:27 PM
#22
Did the PO install the body lift correctly? Who knows?
I seriously doubt a truck with no body lift would have had this issue and 3" only compounded it.
There is no "doom and gloom" message or "ooh you're going to die" with a body lift. Just a simple pictorial showing what happens with one on a good impact.
:wabbit2:
I seriously doubt a truck with no body lift would have had this issue and 3" only compounded it.
There is no "doom and gloom" message or "ooh you're going to die" with a body lift. Just a simple pictorial showing what happens with one on a good impact.
:wabbit2:
Not enough info.
You say no "doom and gloom" but the title has a negative conotation. No pics of the hardware, and as you state yourself, no idea about the quality of the install. Without full info about the incident, it's just an interesting set of pics that allow BL haters to all say "See. I told you so."
06-10-2011, 11:48 PM
#23
Sorry Wabbit. I think it's a bad post.
Not enough info.
You say no "doom and gloom" but the title has a negative conotation. No pics of the hardware, and as you state yourself, no idea about the quality of the install. Without full info about the incident, it's just an interesting set of pics that allow BL haters to all say "See. I told you so."
Not enough info.
You say no "doom and gloom" but the title has a negative conotation. No pics of the hardware, and as you state yourself, no idea about the quality of the install. Without full info about the incident, it's just an interesting set of pics that allow BL haters to all say "See. I told you so."
06-11-2011, 05:49 AM
#24
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I'm not saying that without the BL the truck would still have that kind of damage. I believe that the leverage of the BL did contribute to the body mounts ripping off. It just looks like it was enough of a whack that you'dve had body mount/frame issues anyway.
06-11-2011, 06:59 AM
#25
I'll "rip" out the hardware today and we shall see. 
My thoughts are that if it had been lesser grade hardware the bolts would have sheared instead of ripping through the floor pans. It's all going to the scrap yard anyway, might as well have some fun with it.
The truck was hit from the passenger front as shown here:
:wabbit2:
My thoughts are that if it had been lesser grade hardware the bolts would have sheared instead of ripping through the floor pans. It's all going to the scrap yard anyway, might as well have some fun with it.
The truck was hit from the passenger front as shown here:
:wabbit2:
Last edited by waskillywabbit; 06-11-2011 at 07:01 AM.
06-11-2011, 08:41 AM
#26
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I can tell you with 98% certainty that the body lift was installed incorrectly. See the bottom of the floor where the body lift wore away the paint? That means the body lift was not fastened down all the way or cheap hardware causing the bolt to stretch over a period of time and to be loose causing fatigue to the floor plan. The body lifts I have done on my trucks, I always check them from time to time to make sure they are not loose. Usually I wait a couple of weeks and they are a little loose so I tighten them and they never have been loose after that. I still would run a body lift without hesitation.
James
James
06-11-2011, 10:06 PM
#28
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im a fence sitter on this one, you guys are making good points on both sides...this thread sounds like a good candidate for a debate AS LONG as we can keep it clean and not go at eachothers throats etc.
06-12-2011, 10:51 AM
#29
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Were any additional body mounts used? Performance Accessories tells me that they don't make a body lift for the 3rd generation 4Runner because there are just not enough body mount points. The 2nd generation had ten, the third generation had only 8. 4Crawler makes body mounts, did this truck have them? When you consider the amount of weight that a 4runner body + load is, 8 bolts holding it to the frame is not many compared to the just the cab of a Tacoma xtra cab, which has 6.
If no additional body mounts were used, that would explain the damage to the floor.
If no additional body mounts were used, that would explain the damage to the floor.
06-12-2011, 11:27 AM
#30
Were any additional body mounts used? Performance Accessories tells me that they don't make a body lift for the 3rd generation 4Runner because there are just not enough body mount points. The 2nd generation had ten, the third generation had only 8. 4Crawler makes body mounts, did this truck have them? When you consider the amount of weight that a 4runner body + load is, 8 bolts holding it to the frame is not many compared to the just the cab of a Tacoma xtra cab, which has 6.
If no additional body mounts were used, that would explain the damage to the floor.
If no additional body mounts were used, that would explain the damage to the floor.
This was a 97 and has 10 body mounts.
97-02 have 10 body mounts.
96 had 8 for whatever reason.
:wabbit2:
Last edited by waskillywabbit; 06-12-2011 at 11:29 AM.
06-12-2011, 11:59 AM
#32
8 out of 10 mounts (not front two) pulled the bolt through the washer and floor pans. Washers are still in the truck underneath plastic and carpet.
Bolts look to be Grade 5 standard bolts and do not appear stretched, twisted or deformed.
Pucks are the black ones with hollow spaces just like all the big company aftermarket ones.
(pics when I get home tonight)
Conclusion appears that the washers were too thin for the load applied and ripped right through upon impact.
:wabbit2:
Bolts look to be Grade 5 standard bolts and do not appear stretched, twisted or deformed.
Pucks are the black ones with hollow spaces just like all the big company aftermarket ones.
(pics when I get home tonight)
Conclusion appears that the washers were too thin for the load applied and ripped right through upon impact.
:wabbit2:
06-12-2011, 12:02 PM
#33
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Still, even 10 is not many. Other trucks with similar size and weight have more. Ford Exploder has 12. S10 Jimmy has 12. Two bolts may not seem like much, but it is a 20% difference.
Any way to tell if they were factory washers? That may have something to do with it too.
06-12-2011, 01:08 PM
#34
Only the '96 had 8 eh?
Still, even 10 is not many. Other trucks with similar size and weight have more. Ford Exploder has 12. S10 Jimmy has 12. Two bolts may not seem like much, but it is a 20% difference.
Any way to tell if they were factory washers? That may have something to do with it too.
Still, even 10 is not many. Other trucks with similar size and weight have more. Ford Exploder has 12. S10 Jimmy has 12. Two bolts may not seem like much, but it is a 20% difference.
Any way to tell if they were factory washers? That may have something to do with it too.
I have another 97 4Runner, even the same color that was barrel rolled and crushed the whole top. No body lift and the body is still nice and snug on the frame.
Here's the pics as mentioned above.
:wabbit2:
06-12-2011, 02:14 PM
#35
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My friend just "inherited" for lack of a better term, a 4Runner and we are trying to figure out what to do with it. Searched for body lifts and found this thread. We ruled out a body lift for this truck because we were told than none made one. Then we found a company that does, but you have to get the body mounts.
06-12-2011, 06:41 PM
#36
So Wabbit, did the washers appear to be of good quality, or at least in keeping with what would be included in a kit? I was curious to learn if any washers had been used after looking at the first set of pics. Do you think it would be helpful to add a second smaller washer to try to disperse energy over a larger area?
06-12-2011, 06:54 PM
#37
From looking at them through the floor pan and feeling them with my fingers I can say with pretty good certainty they were NOT the OEM washers reused, much thinner. Still, these washers were grossly deformed like a bowl and the bolt heads pulled through the middle. Big time failure.
:wabbit2:
:wabbit2:
06-13-2011, 12:54 PM
#38
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From looking at them through the floor pan and feeling them with my fingers I can say with pretty good certainty they were NOT the OEM washers reused, much thinner. Still, these washers were grossly deformed like a bowl and the bolt heads pulled through the middle. Big time failure.
:wabbit2:
:wabbit2:
See post #26
What do I win?? LOL!James
06-13-2011, 05:25 PM
#39
It is certainly recommended to re-use the OEM body mount washers. They are specially designed for that job and not the kind of thing you'll find at the local hardware store:
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/ForSale/...ockBodyWashers
Below (L-R) is a standard USS stamped steel washer, a typical OEM body mount washer and a hardened SAE washer:
Not only is the OEM washer thicker and larger in diameter but it is also hardened and has a very tight close fitting bolt hole. It is kind of like a fender washer in terms of overall shape, and both would be helpful for putting a screw or bolt through sheet metal. But the body mount washer is much thicker and harder to resist deforming and pulling through the floor of the vehicle. And you may look at the photo above and say that the OEM washer is not all that much bigger or thicker than the other washers, but it all adds up, for example stiffness goes up with the square of the thickness, twice as thick = four times as stiff. And the hardening of the washer can't really be seen in a picture.
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/ForSale/...ockBodyWashers
Below (L-R) is a standard USS stamped steel washer, a typical OEM body mount washer and a hardened SAE washer:
Not only is the OEM washer thicker and larger in diameter but it is also hardened and has a very tight close fitting bolt hole. It is kind of like a fender washer in terms of overall shape, and both would be helpful for putting a screw or bolt through sheet metal. But the body mount washer is much thicker and harder to resist deforming and pulling through the floor of the vehicle. And you may look at the photo above and say that the OEM washer is not all that much bigger or thicker than the other washers, but it all adds up, for example stiffness goes up with the square of the thickness, twice as thick = four times as stiff. And the hardening of the washer can't really be seen in a picture.
Last edited by 4Crawler; 06-13-2011 at 05:29 PM.
06-13-2011, 05:44 PM
#40
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A little off-topic but TY 4crawler for bringing up those washers. Now know what I am gonna get next for my bumper mounts as the 1/2" grade 8 washers I use now seem to want to bends a little when tightened down. I think it's a better alternative to using double washers.
