AxleIke

Mine is a 1987.

Before you go to a frame shop, you may try simply replacing the entire passenger LCA. Mine had a similar problem, turned out that I had whacked the lower ball joint mount really hard and bent it enough that the caster could not be set. Junk yard visit and 45 bucks later, it aligned perfectly.

PSmith

would you happen to know if the 86-88 and 89-95 upper and lower a arms are the same?

i have a buddy that stripped his 87 IFS parts off, if they were the same i had been planning on swapping them in to see if this fixes the problem... i just havn't had time.

if it turns out that my frame is bent, anyone interested in a full new in box total chaos gen II suspension kit, lower uniballs, heim steering, idler arm and shock hoops?

i really hope the arms or the spindle are the problem and not the frame.

drew303

The suspension components are all the same and I've never heard of the width between those rear LCA mounts ever being 16.5 or 17 depending on year. that seems bogus to me, i wont believe that till i see proof. The front suspensions are the same from 86-95.5 on both the pickup and 4runner.

What is fact is they differ from truck to truck and no two are commonly the same (maybe the day they first got driven off the factory line). What does make sense is the space diminishing as the truck ages (and more rapidly if you're a wheeler). Hence the reason anyone would care to put a brace in there.

W/ my rig I figured out my frame was rolled (bent) using a flash light to get a good perspective on it. Obviously as you saw in the pictures when the truck was torn down you could easily see how bad it was rolled in from a T-bone like accident the PO had it in.

My pass side LCA mount however was noticeably bent in (didnt need a tape measure or a brain surgeon to figure that out). But seeing the bend/roll in the pass side of the frame wasn't so obvious.

With that said you might be able to spread those rear mounts apart and get your camber more to your liking. If you have balljoint spacers and any kind of unacceptable bendage you're screwed. BJ spacers severely limit the range of camber/caster adjustments you make and completely depend on where your torsion bars are set. If you set your torsion bars up stiff (for ride height) you might not be able to get caster or camber right.. To low same deal.. usually best luck is a fine line in the middle that you can accept just enough torsion crank to get camber and caster set.

On that note, to all bj spacer wannabe owners make sure you set your ride height before getting your stuff aligned and really make sure you set both sides the same or the alignment tech might wish you never gave him your truck.

PSmith

according to chaosfab.com there are two different part numbers for their LCA cross braces, an 86-88 one and one for the 89-95. I have a cross brace (not yet installed) but there is no part number on it so I'm not certain which on i have exactly.

i do however know that the brace i have is 17" flange to flange and will not fit into the truck i picked up... hence me trying to align the truck prior to installing anything now as i want to be certain everything on the frame is square. i was planning on calling TC tomorrow for the measurements of the two different part numbers.

hopefully the brace i have is incorrect and the LCA brackets on my 1991 are suppose to be 16.5" apart. if i take a portapower or a bottle jack to the lower arms to push them out to 17" my negative camber problem will only worsen, 20 fold.


thanks for all the insight so far fellas, it is all very much appreciated. keep the ideas comming as i plan to take a look at the truck again tomorrow if time permits.

a protractor to each lower arm balljoint bracket is the first thing on my list of to-do's next. hopefully the passenger side is out of wack in comparison to the driverside.

thanks again.

AxleIke

The 1987 parts will fit the newer truck. My LCA from the junk yard was out of a 94 4runner.

PSmith

according to total chaos, the 86-88 crossbraces are 17" and the 89-95 ones are 16.75". if anything, I'm bent inboard on the lower arm brackets... bending in would cause a positive not negative camber change so this is definitely not the cause of my concern.

ball joint bracket angle to the lower arms appear to be symmetrical, unfortunately.

i'm picking up a set of stock IFS arms tomorrow, hopefully a passenger side spindle also and hoping this will bring my camber back... close enough for me to not stress over it anyway.

if my frame does turn out to be tweaked, what's the prognosis if a shop cant straighten it? would throwing a solid axle and some leafs under a bent frame even be worth while?

bummed.

Sosborne

What bends easy???? EVERYTHING!

Seriously. I've bent everything in a IFS. The Lower control arms bend like aluminum trim. When I messed up the front of my truck last year I wish I would have done a SAS

Next time you replace the idler arm I would get the total chaos one. Its worth it. Before I was blowing arms every year.

AxleIke

LOL.

Well, I dunno about the LCA's, only had one go bad on me. Idlers every year? Until I got narrow tires, lowered my suspension lift, and got a brace, I was breaking them every weekend.

tc

Sounds like operator technique to me ... several people I know wheel hard and haven't ever had problems like that ...

Either that, or you're one of the maybe 5 people on here who truly need a SAS.

Sosborne

When I do go wheeling I dont really break anything. Except the occasional bent idler.

I break stuff being stupid on snow and at work. I spend a good amount of time offroad at work and it always seems that I am always messing stuff up.

I probably dont need an IFS. I more than likely just need to take it easy....But then again I watch the full size guys break stuff on jobsites all the time.

Victor

I've been wanting to put one of those braces but I've dropped my diff. The driveshaft is now lower - right where that cutout has a little metal left. Anyone make a brace for dropped diffs?

elripster

Why not just raise the diff back up? What are your fender to edge of rim measurements?

Frank

Victor

16" with 16" wheels. I dropped the diff 1" to improve my CV angles.

elripster

Ah, I see. Yeah you need that diff drop. That's 16.5" with a 15" wheel, or 3" of lift.

Frank

Victor

3" was about perfect with the Cruiser coils in the rear. I wonder if I can have someone bend round tubing that I can weld in there. It makes dropping the front diff more complicated but how often does that happen? I've done it once to put in the diff with the locker and new gears so I can probably go 100k miles before I do it again.

elripster

If you are not planning on landing on that crossmember it does not need to be very robust. Steel can handle an enormous load in tension/compression. You can simply have a tube bent as you said and welded in place. Actually, you might even get away with say a 1"X2" square tube with a .25" or greater wall thickness. You might needs some .25" stock to offset it downwards but at the very least it will provide a flat surface to which you could attach a custom skid plate later.

Frank

elripster

You know, maybe we should start a new thread since we are highjacking this one.

Frank

87TurboYota

I hate to Hi-Jack your thread here but I was thinking maybe I could get some advice from someone about alignment. My truck just got a recall done to it something have to do with the tie-rod. And ever since it's been out of alignment and my toyota dealership has aligned it twice. It has constant slight pull to the left and it has been the same after everytime the align it. It never pulled before. Does anyone know what could be causing this?

PSmith

i hyjacked this thread and its gone of on at least five different tangents now, don't worry about it.

if it's pulling to the left maybe they were only checking the toe on the alignment rack since all they messed with were the tie rods.

post up your alignment specs, my shot in the dark guess (assuming the toe is in spec) is too much caster on the right or not enough on the left. camber could cause it too... but you'd have to have a hell of a noticeable amount for it to pull.

PSmith

update on my mess:

brought my caster/camber gauge home with me last night so i could get more than an eyeball reference on the truck and i was at -5 on the right 0 on the left.

change the upper arm and crossshaft and picked up 2 degrees on the bad side, change the lower arm and nothing.

so i'm at -3 on the RHS now. (super?)

have a spare spindle i'm going to throw on sometime this weekend but from everyone i've talked to the spindle is the strongest and least likely to bend component on the 4x IFS's. never prayed before but i'm suddenly feeling a bit religious.