hjkmotor

i have 1st gen 3vz with 5 speed. i can hit 90 mph on a flat highway. i mean it takes a while to get there but i can. i shift at 3k and it doesn't bog out or anything. not anymore but i used to drive about 40 miles a day and i could drive a work week on $30 of gas. idk what my mpg is, i dont know how that sounds but i like it compared to my f150 which cost almost 70 bucks to fill it up. i rebulit my engine and i only have about 5k miles on it but im really happy with it so far. i haven't ever had a second gen but iv ridden in one. the choice to me would be between 2door or 4door.


also u will be very happy with the power...... if you never drive a more powerful car.

pb4ugotobed

Hey now... I've had 3 eclipses. (actually a 90 laser, a 91 eclipse gsx, and a 95 talon tsi) all turbo. the cheesy little 4 cyl plymouth laser, with only bolt-on stuff (no internal work at all) was making a little over 450 hp at the wheels and 460+tq. 4 cyl 2.0 liter engine with TONS of room in the engine bay to work.

My 4runner, 3 liter v6 with (comparitively) very little extra room (though believe me, i've seen MUCH worse) makes ~145hp (at the crank)... about 1/4 of the power on a vehicle that weighs twice as much.

If i'm on a drag strip I'd pick the laser. If i'm in a mud pit, I'll pick the yota. Now if only I could drop the 4g63 into the yota... could be fun!

Justinlhc

Like I said, definitely not talking about a STOCK Eclipse. Anything can go fast. There are 10 second Kia's and Hyundai's out there. That doesn't mean you buy one to go fast.

abecedarian

Someone forgot to mention that the Laser was only available with front wheel drive, and 400 HP in a FWD vehicle isn't as fast as it sounds (ask Carroll Shelby about his 450+HP 2.2L Dodge Omni and how much fun that was to drive with the lack of traction in 3rd gear even ), and the Eclipse and Eagle are AWD making them more capable, traction-wise but in no way shape or form comparable to a truck weighing in at near double... and there were no statements about those two vehicles' HP output either. That by itself makes including / comparing the three vehicles irrelevant within themselves and much less relevant using them as a comparison to a purpose-built vehicle.

dewiseman

I had a 90 single cab with 22re and a 95 4runner 3.0. In town the 22re felt quicker but then again there is a considerable weight difference. I live in Washington state and going through the mountains there was a HUGE difference between them. The 3.0 in 5th gear runing up the mountains from 3000 to 3400 RPM will keep climbing (in mine with 430 gears at around 70mph it would keep climbing without down shifting) The 22re even though in the lighter truck body, would be loosing rpm and I could be down to 50mph in 3rd gear to get up some of the hills. The 3.0 on a recent trip from WA to Utah to Wyoming to Colorado to New Mexico and finally Texas ran 70 to 80 mph most of the way and 90mph part of the time with no problems. This on a motor with 253K on it. And got between 17.5 to 19.5 mpg. The 3.0 are not bad, but for some reason, I allways felt that the 22re was a better built motor. NOW, having said all that, i'm going to make it even harder on you. Research the offroad racing forums and you will find that there are an awful lot of guys out there that run built 22re's. You can do alot with that motor without spending alot of money and it will out perform any 3.0. Did I make your choice any easier? LOL

toyota4x4907

Heh. Dewiseman, I have had a '93 single cab 22re 5spd and now a '95 4runner 22re 5spd. For some reason, the 4runner feels a lot quicker. The mods on the 4runner are minimal, performance wise. Both had/have 4.10s and 31x10.5s, and both around the same mileage. I get better mpg in my 4runner that probably easily had 800lbs over the truck, if not more. idk though.

Joey Link

Taking dewiseman's advice and researching 22re modifications, it seems it's not difficult to get to the V6 power levels if need be, so I think I'm going to hold out for a 2nd gen with a 22re and a 5spd, unless I get a ridiculously good deal on a 1st gen with a 22re and a 5spd.

Another question about the 2nd gens, did the 22re 5spd vehicles come with only the bare options, or was it possible to get them optioned and/or fully loaded? They sure are hard to find!

pb4ugotobed

Actually, this is incorrect. The laser was available in a 1.8liter base model, a 2.0 liter non turbo, and a 2.0 liter turbo model available in both front wheel drive AND all wheel drive. The talon's and eclipses were available in the same trims. The main difference between the laser and the talon or eclipse, is the laser didn't (usually) have the side skirts and the other 'luxery' items. The laser was the 'base' model of the bunch with the same guts, just less aesthetics.

I can't even make sense out of the rest of whatever it is that you were rambling about. It's like one incredibly long run-on sentence that doesn't go anywhere.

Tacomolas99

My 2nd gen 4runner is not a prime example. 302,000 miles. I'm also not experienced in working on it. I do agree that the 3.0 basically has V8 mileage with 4-cyl power, that's pretty clever...but I have squeezed 21 mpg outta it on the highway, and it FEELS like it's roaring when I floor it, and I've squealed tires 'round the corners.
I said all that to say this; when it's feasible for me I'd totally put a 3.4 in it!!!
To me the looks are great. Just would like to raise the back end 2 inches or so.
It's my 3rd car and the cheapest I bought, but I'm not looking to get rid of it at all.
So that's me.

irvingdizzle

I have an automatic 93 3vze 4wd with 31x10.5 tires and 4.88 gears. I constantly have to drive on a highway in which there is a good amount of up-hill, and I get a good 65-70mph the entire time. You're going to hate it if you're in a hurry, but i'm always just cruising.

PirateMcgee

A big factor with 22re powered 4runners is elevation. If you live at a high elevation they are plain slow. You're not going to be passing people up hill, you will have to rev the engine out, and third gear up 6% grades is common. It's really easy to get use to the speed of the 4runner so I think a lot of people forget how slow they truly are.

Comparing 22re to 22re

my 93' 2wd 22re 144k miles with intake, exhaust, ignition upgrades can pull up a mountain at 4500-5000ft that's a 6% grade in 5th gear doing however fast I want. Drop into 4th and I can pass with true ease but passing in 5th is possible.

in my 86 4runner 22re less than 10k miles, with ignition upgrades, port polish, late model intake swap, hihger compression pistons, oversized in/ex valves, intake, exahust on the same mountain passing no, 55mph = 3rd gear at which it's reving pretty high.

My 4runner's 22re puts out close to the power of a 3vze (if not more than the ones with high miles) and it's still a dog at elevation plain and simple.

I have driven every type of 1st and 2nd gen 4runner except a v6 1st gen and mine has more power and is faster than any I've ever driven. However it is still slow......

Now I still love it, and it's fine power wise offroad thanks to 4lo. and it's fine for in town daily driving but it lacks on the highway.

Power to weight and brick like aerodynamics dictate this. The numbers don't lie.

22Rob

I run a 22RE behind an automatic tranny in an '87 4Runner and its not a rocket ship, but it does what I need to. I've had no problems driving in traffic around town or on the interstate, just use common sense...thats not to say you have to plan every move like a chess game though! It could be faster, but I was expecting it, so I got used to it pretty quick...besides...it gives people plenty of time to admire my nice Yotatech sticker on the back glass!

yotaman85

i have a 1st gen and a second gen in my driveway, both are being worked on daily, not because they break, its to complete 2 "restofacations".

so driving both a 1986 22re first gen and a 1990 3vze second gen, both automatic and 4x4 with same size tires, id go with the second gen unless you want the retro factor. the second gen is faster, quieter, safer and ALLOT more comfy. but the 3vze is an absolute PITA to work on, not hard, just time consuming, and the 22re is the second easiest motor Ive ever worked on.

but the scale tipper for the 2nd gen is the comfort.

Matt16

I own a 22RE 2nd gen with a 5spd. It certainly isn't say-a-prayer-while-you-merge slow. Its just not noticeably "fast". I can still take it up to 100mph when loaded down with ~1000lbs of people/gear at 4000' elevation WITH a boat on the roof. To get the truck to feel peppy, you gotta rev the motor a bit. Don't worry, that 22RE won't mind, mines been up to 5200rpm. I get 17 city/ 22hwy mpg when I don't try to squeeze the most out of a tank. I have gotten 27mpg once, over a 200mi stretch.

The most important factor to maintain your drivability is to regear to match your tire size- ie: 31" tires require 4.56 gears with the 5spd/ 4.88 gears with automatic. Regear and you'll be fine- the complaints come from kids who try to put their 33x12.5 mud tires their truck that came stock with 28" tires.

IMO the 3ZVE is a game of Russian Roullette for 2 reasons- 1)engine is more prone to failing and perhaps more importantly, 2) the engine is much harder to work on because its shoehorned into the engine bay. The V6 suffers from bad mpgs as well, but is noticeably more powerful, easier to find to buy, and is very smooth and quiet.

Want something dependable and easy to maintain/ fix- get the 22RE. Can't deal with slow and don't care too much about money- get the V6.

girly-yota

Hey Joey thanks for your question - and thanks to everyone who answered. I'm in a similar situation and have been holding out for a manual 22re 1st gen runner, but I really wanted one 100% stock and they are getting harder to find - or are outrageously expensive. You are right about there being way more 2nd gen runners out there for about the same $$. The 1990 I'm looking at has 52K orig miles, is a manual 3.0 but has a bad alternator. I drive a 3.0 Honda Accord and I had to replace the alternator at 110K miles... either way, it's not smogged and hasn't been registered since 2008. Should any of this raise red flags or concerns about other problems? I'm not mechanically inclined enough to know one way or the other. Any tips would be great. Thanks!

g_cali

Well if it hasn't been registered in 2 years im guessing there's something wrong with it.

You should have bought my stock 86 a couple months ago!

ROCKGUARD 1

my '90 4run underwent a massive rebuild last year. 3.0 was completely redone and new everything went on. im using 10w30 mobil 1 synthetic oil, k&n air filter and 89 octane gas. the thing loves to rev and pushes 32" mud tire just fine. gonna put a flowmaster 2.25" exhaust on it and call it done. i like the 3.0. runs ultra smooth and has enuff balls to get itself loaded with gear out to the middle of nowhere, and still have me back to work for monday morning.

imbatman19

Proud owner of a 1990 3vze. A340h automatic. I love my lil runner for the comfort and 4x ability. I admit, a little grumpy when you tap the skinny pedal but gets excited when you stomp on it. Utilizing the OD on/off switch and the ect power switch as needed works wonders to wake up the snoozing guzzler. 15 to18 mpg is nothing to brag about but if I was in it to get the miles I would have bought a Geo. 31x10.5 tires came stock so I have a more aggressive gearing in the rear box. This will be my third, put the first upside down, the second fell asleep in the 3rd cylinder at 365,000 miles and this one is running strong at nearly 200. As far as working on it yourself, the only hard part is getting under the intake for injectors and valve covers, the rest of the runner is basic. Tight in a few corners but doable. Favorites include, shift on the fly 4x, climbs trees in low if you ask nicely, hot heater and toyota icy cold AC, cargo room, serviceability, comfort, ride height (taller stock than most lifted rigs), and finally it's fun to take out on the trails. You wanna race, buy a charger. You want a runner, buy a toy.

NocturnalRunner

My 93 4runner V6 is not lacking any power. i leave alot of cars in the dust on the freeway no problem. maybe its cause my truck is pretty much stock. no lift. only thing different is from tires which are 31x105 15" and no mods under the hood. makes sence if someone lifts the truck adds a bigger tire with no compensation for power. takes more power to push a bigger tire...not trying to act like i know what im talking bout. just using common(which is uncommon >_<) sence.

Woody

I've owned both. My 1st gen with the 3.0 and my current 2nd gen with the 3.0. I like my 1st gen better. But it had the 5 speed. My current 2nd gen does alright. Good for offroad, but hauling a lot of expedition equipment weighted down, it's a complete dog. I have a friend with a 1st gen 22re that did better than me fuel mileage and power.