New 22re jumped timing chain!
05-01-2010, 03:17 PM
#41
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well if thats the case then probably best to just replace the vavles yourself, that way you know its good, shouldnt be too hard to do. or buy a complete head i think there 300 and put it on there. I have had mine for a little over a month and have 600 miles on my engine I rebuild and its had issues, egr wtuck open, clutch master failed..ect. but in the end once i get everything up to par it will be a good vehicle.
05-01-2010, 03:25 PM
#43
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lol man I know how to pull the head, and install everything, and blah blah blah.......I wish I would have done the engine myself but the circumstances of when the rod went through the block of the original engine forced my hand in to getting a long block.
anyways none of this really helps the given situation........
anyways none of this really helps the given situation........
05-01-2010, 03:51 PM
#46
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there's no good answer for you for what is going on. it would be very easy for me to say give them hell (the company)....and even if they say they will replace it for free and pay the shipping you still have the PITA job of pulling this thing. i assume and / or hope there was some sort of warranty...if anything, you have it documented well here on this thread what went on.
give the company the benefit of the doubt....
easy for me to say from here.
other side of the mouth says rebuild or replace the head....equally easy for me to say coming from someone who has taken the better part of 8 months to complete the head and timing repair on mine. money and skill were 2 prohibiting factors for me.
if you can....walk away....don't touch it, don't look at it....don't call the company when you are mad...you have to have a clear brain and remain objective.
most of all good luck man....i feel terrible for you....that is little consolation but that's about all i can offer you other than encouragement and pictures.
give the company the benefit of the doubt....
easy for me to say from here.
other side of the mouth says rebuild or replace the head....equally easy for me to say coming from someone who has taken the better part of 8 months to complete the head and timing repair on mine. money and skill were 2 prohibiting factors for me.
if you can....walk away....don't touch it, don't look at it....don't call the company when you are mad...you have to have a clear brain and remain objective.
most of all good luck man....i feel terrible for you....that is little consolation but that's about all i can offer you other than encouragement and pictures.
05-01-2010, 04:16 PM
#47
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I'm not one to easily get upset and never take it out on people when they mess up......generally just try to resolve the manner as politely as possible. I'm starting to near the end of my rope with this engine/builder though. Mostly though I'm highly disappointed and getting somewhat desperate as I HAVE to have a 4wd vehicle that is reliable for my upcoming internship starting in June. It would be fine if I had all this extra time and money but this 4runner is running me out of both.
Thanks for the kind words 92
Thanks for the kind words 92
05-01-2010, 04:18 PM
#48
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no prob...
i started with no skills and grew frequently and easily frustrated.
i have no spare $$$ and little spare time so i can sympathize with you.
i started with no skills and grew frequently and easily frustrated.
i have no spare $$$ and little spare time so i can sympathize with you.
05-01-2010, 04:55 PM
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got done with the bore scope.......
all the pistons have several mm deep gashes
couldn't get a good look at the valves but they are destroyed as well I'm sure.
all the pistons have several mm deep gashes
couldn't get a good look at the valves but they are destroyed as well I'm sure.
05-01-2010, 06:08 PM
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check for anything fuel and spark related one of your screens in your injectors could be plugged and or a faulty wire you have everything right in the timing aspect be cause i have gone through the same crap ,i ended up changing plugs,wires,o2 sensor and cleaned the injectors it runs alot better and i set the valves at 7 and eleven sounds nice now
05-02-2010, 02:56 PM
#52
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ok so got the motor out and everything.......pulled the head off and in every piston there is a mark from the intake and exhaust valve. Can't see anything on the valves though......so what do you guys think......bent valves? Do you think the bottom end and pistons are fine?
05-02-2010, 03:12 PM
#53
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my opinion...yes.
but remember, i am fairly new to this....but i would think that piston versus valve.....piston wins
but remember, i am fairly new to this....but i would think that piston versus valve.....piston wins
Last edited by 92 TOY; 05-02-2010 at 03:13 PM.
05-02-2010, 04:33 PM
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So the reason the engine got sent back in the first place was due to a bad valve guide that fell out and broke apart. Pieces got into the cylinder and damaged the piston and the head. As it turns out they did not replace the head or the damaged piston but it does appear that they machined the head down slightly to lessen the marks on the head? Is it possible they machined it too far down or did not provide a thicker head gasket causing slack in the timing chain?
05-02-2010, 06:51 PM
#56
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The tensioner has enough range to make up for any reasonable shortened distance between crank and cam. My guess is something else was/is wrong with the tensioner.
Sorry to hear about your ordeal. Very frustrating, but hang in there.
Sorry to hear about your ordeal. Very frustrating, but hang in there.
05-02-2010, 06:57 PM
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I don't think so. They would only be machining a little bit off the head, you can only mill so much. That small amount (maybe .010 or .020 inch max) *shouldn't* be enough to cause too much slack in the timing chain that the tensioner couldn't handle. At least, that's my opinion, but not a very educated one.
This story has gone from weird to screwball with your last post. I was unaware of the valve guide falling out the first time, I thought it was just the problem with the timing chain jumping, which is problematic enough.
Depending on how bad the damage was, and where the damage occured, they probably should have replaced the head, and definately the piston, which brings up another question. Was the cylinder wall damaged or scored in any way? If so, that would have meant they would have had to at least hone that cylinder enough to remove the damage, which means a new piston to match that size, which means all new pistons and bores to match.
And, machining the head to remove the marks doesn't make sense to me. The marks should have been in the combustion chamber, not the gasket surface. When you mill a head, you don't mill the combustion chamber, you mill the surface. So, milling it shouldn't have removed any damage marks.
You said they didn't replace the piston the first time, which would mean you can see the dings from where the valve guide grenaded, plus the marks from where the valves hit this time. Correct?
In light of this new evidence, it appears to me that they messed up the first time, failed to correctly remedy their first mistake, which ended up causing this whole cluster*#%. I would more than likely be demanding that they take more responsibility and correct their original mistake the right way.
I wouldn't worry much about the rods, they can take a lot of abuse. They will push a piston right into a valve and not ever know it, considering they take thousands of PSI in normal running. The bearings are another story, IF any pieces of the valve guide found their way in a bearing. I think the odds of that are pretty slim though, since it would have to get past the rings first. More than likely, any pieces that weren't still in the cylinder were blown out the exhaust.
That's my 2 cents.
This story has gone from weird to screwball with your last post. I was unaware of the valve guide falling out the first time, I thought it was just the problem with the timing chain jumping, which is problematic enough.
Depending on how bad the damage was, and where the damage occured, they probably should have replaced the head, and definately the piston, which brings up another question. Was the cylinder wall damaged or scored in any way? If so, that would have meant they would have had to at least hone that cylinder enough to remove the damage, which means a new piston to match that size, which means all new pistons and bores to match.
And, machining the head to remove the marks doesn't make sense to me. The marks should have been in the combustion chamber, not the gasket surface. When you mill a head, you don't mill the combustion chamber, you mill the surface. So, milling it shouldn't have removed any damage marks.
You said they didn't replace the piston the first time, which would mean you can see the dings from where the valve guide grenaded, plus the marks from where the valves hit this time. Correct?
In light of this new evidence, it appears to me that they messed up the first time, failed to correctly remedy their first mistake, which ended up causing this whole cluster*#%. I would more than likely be demanding that they take more responsibility and correct their original mistake the right way.
I wouldn't worry much about the rods, they can take a lot of abuse. They will push a piston right into a valve and not ever know it, considering they take thousands of PSI in normal running. The bearings are another story, IF any pieces of the valve guide found their way in a bearing. I think the odds of that are pretty slim though, since it would have to get past the rings first. More than likely, any pieces that weren't still in the cylinder were blown out the exhaust.
That's my 2 cents.
05-03-2010, 07:15 AM
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It has apparently been too long since I've last had one of these motors apart. I see what you mean by the head now.
I wish I remembered what my pistons look like. Those are clearly aftermarket, right? It seems to me like the valves hit the pistons in weird spots. It looks like the pistons have cutouts for either a 3 or 4 valve head. (2 intake, 1 or 2 exhaust) Or, are the valves oriented different directions from one cylinder to the next, hence the reason for the cutouts, to accomodate 1 valve from either direction? I don't remember. Anyone else?
Either way, it seems like those cutouts aren't lining up with the opened valve, otherwise it should have hit right at the bottom of one of the cutouts, not where the marks ended up. I hope somebody can clear that up for me, as it has been too long for me to remember.
That is definately some shoddy work by OER. Maybe a new guy built your motor the first time?
I wish I remembered what my pistons look like. Those are clearly aftermarket, right? It seems to me like the valves hit the pistons in weird spots. It looks like the pistons have cutouts for either a 3 or 4 valve head. (2 intake, 1 or 2 exhaust) Or, are the valves oriented different directions from one cylinder to the next, hence the reason for the cutouts, to accomodate 1 valve from either direction? I don't remember. Anyone else?
Either way, it seems like those cutouts aren't lining up with the opened valve, otherwise it should have hit right at the bottom of one of the cutouts, not where the marks ended up. I hope somebody can clear that up for me, as it has been too long for me to remember.
That is definately some shoddy work by OER. Maybe a new guy built your motor the first time?
