tried4x2signN

Any of you guys wanting 5, 7MG and 2jz motors in your 4WD ever wonder why they don't put Ferrari motors in dump trucks?

I mean, the Ferrari has more "Horsepower", right? Why not?


EDIT: An engine out of a Formula 1 car would have even more horsepower.

An F1 engine in a dump truck... That thing would really haul then...

bigtrucknwheels

but a dump truck needs torque more so than horsepower. we don't need a dump truck that can go 150 MPH

as far as swapping in one the motors you listed, its a noticeable increase in torque (very usuable on the trail and other low speed applications, such as getting off the line quick) and of course a substantial increase in horsepower (passing, ascending grades, and speeeed).

Personally, if I could come across a 7MGTE complete for a good price, I would nab it up. My 89 is a perfect swap candidate. Oh man, would that be a fun daily driver or what! Gets better gas mileage than the 22RE if you don't go crazy building up the motor and you can keep your foot out of the skinny pedal lol.

tried4x2signN

At what RPM?

Those de-stroked car motors are top-end, useless in a 4WD.

There is a guy on Mud that's done a 7MG swap and says he wouldn't do it again. There is more mid-range but less bottom end. Depends on where you spend your time.

To see WHERE an engine produces its power, pay attention to more than just how much "horsepower" the number is. Look at what RPM it produces it at.

tried4x2signN

IMO it'd be easier to get a cheap (still produced) RTE exhaust manifold, a CT26 (off a 7MGTE) or Garrett Turbo and the RTE computer, Injectors, Distributor and a few other bits.

And as long as we're keeping our foot out of it, the same rule applies.

And you'll get better bottom-end. And be able to wheel longer on a tank of gas. Plus, you already have the engine all you have to do is rebuild it and decompress it a little for the 7 factory psi CT26. More if you wanted to go with the Garrett though.


22RTE conversion for beginners
CT26 Installation

bigtrucknwheels

yeah, all good things to consider. I didn't know they still made the turbo exhaust manifolds yet.

I would never do this swap to a truck I intended to wheel a lot, for the above mentioned reasons. But for a daily driver and occasional offroading, I think the 7MGTE would be sweet. The 22RTE is great, but as far as beating stock mustangs, it isn't gonna happen. I love to put Mustangs and ricers to shame, I would love to do it even more in an old Toyota Pickup hahaha. 4WD burnouts, anyone?

But anyways, just out of curiosity, whats a RTE swap running, labor excluded?

tried4x2signN

ok... This doesn't make any sense...

"The 22RTE is great, but as far as beating stock mustangs, it isn't gonna happen."

Are you implying a 7MGTE will? Not sure I get that... A +/- 200hp engine with MASSIVE H.G issues, in a 4,000 lb 4WD... doing battle with Mustangs?

You do know the 7MG in not a direct bolt-on right? There will be welding and cutting and moving parts around...

So why ask what a RTE swap is running w/ labor?

You're not going to do 4WD burnouts with 2, or even 300hp... I doubt 1,000 would do it. You would feel like Buck Rodgers going into hyperdrive though... Remember the stars in Star Wars when they engaged warp speed? Watch out for the neigbors house!

Check out the difference in the 7MG and 2jZ. Unless I am mistaken the 2jZ has way more head bolts and they're in better placement, and it has 7 main bearings.

I might be wrong (EDIT: On the 7MG, I am) but I think the 7MG has only 4 main bearings, like the 3Fe... Can't remember.

One things fer sure though. The 7MG won't see hp numbers even close to a 2jZ... So something's different.

I read somewhere the 7MG bottom-end is rated at 600hp stock, the 2jz 900hp, stock!

And pretty sure the "stroker" crank for the 2jz is a 1fz crank from a Landcruiser FzJ80. Might as well put that motor in if you can find one...

Oh, and put a vvT-i head from a Lexus on the 2jz or 1fz IF you get this far...

tried4x2signN

yew get all that?

bigtrucknwheels

EXCLUDING labor, is what I meant, skillet haha. The 7MGTE is a much more straight forward swap than a 2JZ, and can be built to 300 RWHP reasonably. Head gasket is good for 60k or so, as long as you don't go boost crazy.

5MGE motor mounts and a 7MGE manual bellhousing will allow the direct bolt in of a 7MGTE in a 22RE/W56 truck. You will have to hammer the fire wall and cut out some of the rad support, but def workable. Known trouble spots include exhaust routing, fuel supply, and perhaps the toughest of all, power steering and air conditioning.

All in all, if I was gonna build something crazy, I would go 2JZ, no doubt. But if I were to make a semi-fast and fun to drive truck that is fairly easy to do, I would def. go with the 7MGTE. That, and I love old school stuff haha.

I am not talking crap, I have really researched this and have a bunch of links bookmarked specifically pertaining to doing the 7MGTE swap. I think, though, that www.supracharged.com is a great site.

Junkers88

I wonder if I can get a couple of college credits from reading that? Very well said.

tried4x2signN

Sorry I missed the labor excluded... How good are you at sourcing parts? That's too difficult a question to answer.

You, need to form a plan if this is your angle of attack. The 1st thing that jumps to mind is, is the tranny you're gonna be using (I'll assume a W56) going to be rated for the power coming from the I6?

IMO, you're setting yourself up for a week link... A catastrophic link that if it breaks will stop you cold.

I'd get some conservative #'s for a lightly modded 7MGTE and then find out what the rating is on a W56 is. Oh, and I don't think you're gonna be easy with it so let's be real here...

Pretty sure you'll find that tranny's too weak... I could be wrong though...

Then you're back to "do I use a R150 trans?" And I believe a bellhousing for a 2jz will be super easy to find for that tranny...

bigtrucknwheels

Very good points. I would much prefer to use the r150, but as we all know, there is no good way to bolt it up to a 7M. Changing the input shafts to use a 7MGTE bellhousing alters the first gear ratio to a steeper climb, exact opposite of what you want in a truck. Fabricating and machining a bellhousing to fit the stock R150 is cost prohibitive and extremely difficult.

For a quick and dirty swap, the w56 is o.k. but like you said, def. the weakest link. It is said w56 will take 300 HP, but I dunno, I have always disliked the w56 part of the equation. And you're right, I wouldn't be easy on it haha.

I can def. source parts, but the issue is, stuff like that is really hard to come by in central PA, heck, even the east coast for that matter. So now I gotta take someone's word for it instead of seeing for myself, pay astronomical fees to have everything shipped, and should I forget something, it will set me back a few days for every item I am missing.

All that being said, in the end, if I do any sort of serious modifications to one of my Toyota's, I will probably be doing them to my 4Runner. Go TRD s/c with URD 7th injector kit and piggy back computer, 2.2" pulley, and some sort of exhaust system. Tweak it, and hope for the 250 HP zone. Not a hot-rod, but it would sound sick and pull pretty darn good. The aftermarket support is out there, the parts are ample, and the 5VZFE is arguably one of Toyota's most rugged V6's (7 main bearings on the crank).

tried4x2signN

you've lost me on the input shaft, bellhousing, ratio and steeper climb.


I just want to drop this little bit-o info for ya...

if by steeper climb you mean "lower gear" that's not necessarily bad. IMO, Toyota made the 1st gear in the R151f lower than any other 5speed for a reason, and it wasn't for pulling.

It was so the Turbo would spool up faster. You have to remember turbo's were highly inefficient and a burgeoning technology in gas motors at the time. That's where "Turbo lag" came from. It was because of old, heavy inefficient wheels that took forever to come on to boost...

Bottom line, if you're fast enough (1-2 shift) it's not necessarily bad. It will come up to boost almost instantly.

EDIT: And you will retain A LOT of off road ability in your truck b/c you'll be at operating RPMs that closer match the output of the engine.
You're speed will be down and your RPM's up.

It's your off idle power and shifting gears that will suffer, but only till the power comes on.

bigtrucknwheels

no doubt, but the big issue is speed control. The gearing of the Supra trans' first gear is taller (can go a faster speed in that gear) than the factory gear, which is less desirable when offroading over rocks and obstacles. All in all though, I think it would be manageable off road and desirable on road.

forbiddenera

Bellhousing is here, just have to fab mounts.. Need a welder

Dipstik_90

My buddy has a 7mgte swapped truck and it does beat stock Mustangs even some lightly modded ones I know I've driven it and beat them. MLS headgasket and ARP head bolts boost to 30psi. 300hp will do 4wd burnouts but you have to tie the truck to something, well obviously cause you couldn't use the brakes.

annoyingrob

I think people seem to forget that the MA70 Supra that the 7M-GTE came out of was ALSO almost 4000 pounds. Curb weights ranged from 3500-3800 depending on options. Stock gearing being 26" tires with 3.73 rear-end isn't much different than the trucks either.

tried4x2signN

great point, but cars aren't 4WD either and 4WD's can quite easily be tasked with spending lots of time at idle or just above it, and with an additional load the rolling resistance of pushing another axle and two tires would give...