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I just installed a new (used) 3VZE into my 93 4runner 4X4 auto and now that it is installed, it is very hard to turn the engine. It takes about 2 feet of leverage to turn it over easily. It was perfectly fine before I installed it, and I could turn it over with a 3/8 drive ratchet and socket. I compared it with my toyota pickup with a 3VZE which is also far easier to turn. The torque converter was turning freely when I installed it, and it seemed to all mate together without any troubles or forcing. I could not find any other threads about this issue. Does anyone have any idea what this could be?? I just put a new torque converter in it too since it didn't have one when I got it. The torque converter was very hard to find, so the only thing I could think of is it being the wrong one. But it fit like a glove and bolted to the flex plate just fine. Any pointers would be extremely appreciated, thank you.
So youre not hooked up to starter, ignition, etc. The motors just dropped in and youre turning it over by hand?
Hard to compare. The 3vz you pulled must have had problems and maybe had low compression. if thats what youre used to then a fresh motor might seem hard.
does the new motor have oil in it?
So youre not hooked up to starter, ignition, etc. The motors just dropped in and youre turning it over by hand?
Hard to compare. The 3vz you pulled must have had problems and maybe had low compression. if thats what youre used to then a fresh motor might seem hard.
does the new motor have oil in it?
The motor is completely hooked up and ready to start. The starter itself has a hard time turning it over. I did a compression test before it was installed and all of the cylinders were around 170 psi. And I could easily turn it by hand when it was out. It's installed now and it got hard to turn after it was connected to to TC and Trans. The engine is very hard to turn even with all the plugs out
It is very hard to turn even with all the plugs out.. compression was around 170 on all cylinders, and could be turned by hand before it was installed
Hi:
Either the T/C is the wrong one (size, too fat,too tall, whatever), or it is not seated into the transmission pump all the way.
Seating the T/C into the transmission properly, should result in a satisfying metallic clank when the hub bottoms in the pump.
This is done while rotating the T/C gently with the inside, and outside of the hub being wet with fluid. There will be some slight resistance because the seal rings are new, but you are looking for the hard "clank"
Or is it possible that the flex plate is installed backwards on the crankshaft?
Usually there is a integral mounted stiffening ring on one side of the flex plate and not on the other, this could orient the plate too far out from the engine on the crank flange.
The result being freedom of rotation when the T/C is mounted on the transmission, but a major bind when the engine is bolted up.
When you are turning the engine over, are there any scraping sounds, or intermittent hard spots?
Did you use OEM T/C bolts? They are properly sized for the space they live in.
H/D or Lowes have grade 8 bolts also , but the heads are usually too tall for that job.
At any rate, I think an engine pull, or transmission drop is in your future.
Good Luck
Art
.
Hi:
Either the T/C is the wrong one (size, too fat,too tall, whatever), or it is not seated into the transmission pump all the way.
Seating the T/C into the transmission properly, should result in a satisfying metallic clank when the hub bottoms in the pump.
This is done while rotating the T/C gently with the inside, and outside of the hub being wet with fluid. There will be some slight resistance because the seal rings are new, but you are looking for the hard "clank"
Or is it possible that the flex plate is installed backwards on the crankshaft?
Usually there is a integral mounted stiffening ring on one side of the flex plate and not on the other, this could orient the plate too far out from the engine on the crank flange.
The result being freedom of rotation when the T/C is mounted on the transmission, but a major bind when the engine is bolted up.
When you are turning the engine over, are there any scraping sounds, or intermittent hard spots?
Did you use OEM T/C bolts? They are properly sized for the space they live in.
H/D or Lowes have grade 8 bolts also , but the heads are usually too tall for that job.
At any rate, I think an engine pull, or transmission drop is in your future.
Good Luck
Art
.
Thank you, I really appreciate the response. Ive loosened up the engine to transmission bolts, now it turns over freely. I looked at the flex plate and it appears to be on the correct way. This is going off of pictures of other engines on the internet. The ring gear is favoring towards the rear of the vehicle. After that I checked to see if the spacer is on the correct side. I pushed a piece of wire up there to feel if it's on the TC side, and it is. I know I put it on the correct side, I wouldn't have just guessed. I THOUGHT I remember (not 100% sure, but I thought I remember there being 2 spacers. One went on before the Flexplate, then the Flexplate, then other spacer, then bolts. I do not recall any scraping or hard spots. It was consistently hard to turn (about 100 ft pounds to turn). The bolts are the correct ones. I lost 2 and had to go to pick n pull to get new ones since they are a unique thread size. So they are the correct bolts. As for the TC, I do not remember hearing a "click". I just wiggled it on 2 different stages then it wouldn't go on any further. I think im going to start pulling the transmission to get a better idea of what's going on. I know something is seriously incorrect between the engine and transmission.
And I will keep this thread going until this problem is fixed, to hopefully help anyone else in the future.
Last edited by YotaSyclone; 01-11-2021 at 04:14 PM.
Hi:
I am suspicious of the statement "the ring gear is favoring the rear of the vehicle".
The last time I had the engine out of my Runner was 11 years ago, so my memory is blank on that one.
I would think that because of the limited space in that area, you would want the plate to be as far forward (front of vehicle) as possible.
Is the plate manufactured with a dish depression that could offset the North/South orientation in any way?
If that is so, then I would think that the concave side of the dish depression should be bolted to the face of the crank flange.
This would effectively move the plate forward, (front of vehicle) and provide the most clearance, allowing the T/C hub to seat at the correct depth in the pump.
Please say that you didn't run the engine with this binding condition existing.
A condition such as this will destroy the transmission pump almost immediately upon the engine firing up.
Good Luck
Art.
Hi:
I am suspicious of the statement "the ring gear is favoring the rear of the vehicle".
The last time I had the engine out of my Runner was 11 years ago, so my memory is blank on that one.
I would think that because of the limited space in that area, you would want the plate to be as far forward (front of vehicle) as possible.
Is the plate manufactured with a dish depression that could offset the North/South orientation in any way?
If that is so, then I would think that the concave side of the dish depression should be bolted to the face of the crank flange.
This would effectively move the plate forward, (front of vehicle) and provide the most clearance, allowing the T/C hub to seat at the correct depth in the pump.
Please say that you didn't run the engine with this binding condition existing.
A condition such as this will destroy the transmission pump almost immediately upon the engine firing up.
Good Luck
Art.
.
I dropped the transmission today, and I am quite positive that I had the flex plate installed properly. If I flipped it over it would just be hitting the engine block. There was a spacer on the engine side, and a spacer on the TC side of the flex plate. I will try and post the pictures. I took measurements of the seating depth of the TC from the bell housing face. The pilot is 3/16" deep, and the 6 mounting pads are 15/16" deep from bell housing face. I cant find any info on how far in it should be. I cannot get the TC to go any farther in. I just wiggle it onto the 2 sets of splines and that is as far as it will go. It still turns freely too. One thing that I did not do was grease the TC pilot. Im wondering if maybe the pilot didn't fit into the little hole on the crank properly and was a little tight? Maybe I need to clean out the hole and maybe sand some of the paint off the pilot and grease it so it seats in better. That's all I can think of. When I loosened all the transmission/engine bolts, it only opened up maybe 1/32" so it wasn't that much, but enough to keep the engine from turning freely.
: Hi: I don't know if this will help, but it is all I could find regarding T/C measurements.
This is from a 95 4Runner FSM, but I'm pretty sure that it pertains to your car also.
Art
The starter pinion engages the ring facing the rear of the car right? OK then, what side of the ring gear is the worn side from the pinion engagement?
That will tell you positively whether the plate is mounted correctly or not.
Last edited by ZARTT; 01-18-2021 at 01:10 AM.
Reason: Further question
: Hi: I don't know if this will help, but it is all I could find regarding T/C measurements.
This is from a 95 4Runner FSM, but I'm pretty sure that it pertains to your car also.
Art
The starter pinion engages the ring facing the rear of the car right? OK then, what side of the ring gear is the worn side from the pinion engagement?
That will tell you positively whether the plate is mounted correctly or not.
I check the side of the ring gear with the wear. The side the ring gear favors away from is the worn side, so I had it correct the first time.
I've also noticed some deformation on the TC pilot. Like it wasn't fully seated correctly or fit.
Last edited by YotaSyclone; 01-20-2021 at 03:20 PM.
Hi:
Did the replacement engine come from a manually shifted car?
If it did, is there still a pilot bearing, or a piece of one in the crank cavity?
If so, it must be removed so the T/C nose will fit into the crankshaft.
The crankshaft cavity just supports the T/C nose, they don't spin relatve to each other, so a bearing is not needed.
I'm running out of ideas here.
Clean out the crank cavity, and get all that paint off of the T/C nose.
Polish it up with some fine crocus cloth, and the cavity also.
Dress the nose with a fine file to remove burrs.
What is that red ring around the nose? Is it a washer, or spacer of some kind or paint?
You mentioned that the T/C you got was hard to locate, so are you 100% sure that they sent you the correct one?
Art.
The Amayama OEM P/N for a T/C for frame # VZN130L 4Runner is 32000-35090.
This frame was manufactured in the period 4/89 to 11/95.
See if this part # crosses over to your P/N, with the vendor you purchased your T/C from.
Last edited by ZARTT; 01-21-2021 at 09:52 AM.
Reason: another question
Hi:
Did the replacement engine come from a manually shifted car?
If it did, is there still a pilot bearing, or a piece of one in the crank cavity?
If so, it must be removed so the T/C nose will fit into the crankshaft.
The crankshaft cavity just supports the T/C nose, they don't spin relatve to each other, so a bearing is not needed.
I'm running out of ideas here.
Clean out the crank cavity, and get all that paint off of the T/C nose.
Polish it up with some fine crocus cloth, and the cavity also.
Dress the nose with a fine file to remove burrs.
What is that red ring around the nose? Is it a washer, or spacer of some kind or paint?
You mentioned that the T/C you got was hard to locate, so are you 100% sure that they sent you the correct one?
Art.
The Amayama OEM P/N for a T/C for frame # VZN130L 4Runner is 32000-35090.
This frame was manufactured in the period 4/89 to 11/95.
See if this part # crosses over to your P/N, with the vendor you purchased your T/C from.
Holy ˟˟˟˟, theres the problem.. its part of the pilot bearing
That looks like half of the pilot bearing lodged in there. I never noticed that when I first put it all together.
Now I need to figure out a way to get it out. Its really stuck in there
Last edited by YotaSyclone; 01-21-2021 at 03:18 PM.
Hi:
Good on you mate.
It appears to be slide hammer time.
You can purchase a slide hammer kit from Bejing Freight for probably less than $25.00.
Use the hook and I'll bet it comes out in less than 3 whacks.
Any excuse to buy another tool.
Also, I don't know if you are aware of the one bolt hole in the flex plate that isn't perfectly round.
You should start bolting the flex plate to the converter using that hole, if it isn't butchered up.
You can torque that bolt to spec and be sure that the rest are registered perfectly to their holes.
This will allow you to torque the rest to spec. all in one pass of plate rotation. (least pain in the ass method)
It goes without saying that you should use the crank nut on the front of the engine to rotate it.
Don't lever the engine over using the starter ring, that could maybe misalign the bolt holes.
Take out the plugs to make it easier.
Happy bolting, and good luck with the startup.
Art.
While you have the transmission out, why not put in a nice fresh crank seal.
You will be glad you did in a couple of months of running.
Also, use only the red Toyota coolant, never plain water, or the green stuff.
Art.
Last edited by ZARTT; 01-21-2021 at 06:29 PM.
Reason: more info.
[QUOTE=ZARTT;52457481]Hi:
Good on you mate. [QUOTE]
Seriously thank you for the help. I got a slide hammer and it came out. I'll keep what you said in mind while I reassemble it and im installing a new crank seal. I'll post another update or 2 when she goes back together. Thanks alot for the help!
Last edited by YotaSyclone; 01-23-2021 at 10:58 AM.
01-04-2021, 04:01 PM
