22re will not reach operating temperature - Noob
09-12-2020, 09:24 PM
#1
22re will not reach operating temperature - Noob
Hello all, I recently picked up an '85 pickup and she's just being broken in at 182,000 miles. The engine runs well and nothing is overtly wrong besides what I assume to be a loose timing chain tick.
However, the temperature gauge only reaches about 15% of the way up even after an hour on the highway. I smell exhaust and assume that the engine is running rich. She chugs gas - may be the fact that I'm new to manual transmissions - but I do smell exhaust inside the cab when I come to a stop.
I am a novice and would appreciate any knowledge on this matter. Could these two issues be connected? If so, what do I do about the low operating temp on the engine?
Thank you
However, the temperature gauge only reaches about 15% of the way up even after an hour on the highway. I smell exhaust and assume that the engine is running rich. She chugs gas - may be the fact that I'm new to manual transmissions - but I do smell exhaust inside the cab when I come to a stop.
I am a novice and would appreciate any knowledge on this matter. Could these two issues be connected? If so, what do I do about the low operating temp on the engine?
Thank you
09-13-2020, 12:11 AM
#2
Registered User
The computer will enrich the fuel mixture if the coolant is cold, so that might be why you are running rich. Your thermostat is probably bad, or it could be a cheap one that is letting too much coolant flow through when it is closed. OEM Toyota thermostats are the best, and they make a dual stage thermostat to stop gauge overshoot. The previous owner might have drilled a hole in your thermostat to stop that problem. The first thing to do is verify coolant temp with a thermometer to make sure it is not just your gauge reading incorrectly. Depending on the thermostat, it should be around 180-190 degrees.
The following users liked this post:
iamthespliff (09-13-2020)
09-13-2020, 06:47 AM
#3
Registered User
The previous owner may have installed a 160 degree t-stat. In my 92, I am running an OEM 190 degree single-stage t-stat, part #90916-03078. Gauge reads 1/2 way after reaching operating temp & stays put no matter city or highway, AC on or off, or outside temp.
09-13-2020, 08:51 AM
#4
Registered User
I'd start with replacing the thermostat so you know what you're working with. Unless you can find out what the previous owner installed. But yes, a bit below halfway up is where mine runs, steady as a rock.
As to smelling exhaust, many leaks you can pick up with your ear when it's idling. Just listen from front to back to see if you can hear where it's leaking. Also, look at the exhaust manifold to cylinder head connection for black soot to see if the gasket is leaking. And if it's a 4Runner (you didn't say pickup or 4Runner), you'll smell exhaust if the back window is open or leaking a lot of air.
You said "chugs gas" -- what kind of mileage are you getting? I get about 16MPH in mostly city driving in my '87 22RE with EFI.
As to smelling exhaust, many leaks you can pick up with your ear when it's idling. Just listen from front to back to see if you can hear where it's leaking. Also, look at the exhaust manifold to cylinder head connection for black soot to see if the gasket is leaking. And if it's a 4Runner (you didn't say pickup or 4Runner), you'll smell exhaust if the back window is open or leaking a lot of air.
You said "chugs gas" -- what kind of mileage are you getting? I get about 16MPH in mostly city driving in my '87 22RE with EFI.
09-13-2020, 09:59 AM
#6
I'd start with replacing the thermostat so you know what you're working with. Unless you can find out what the previous owner installed. But yes, a bit below halfway up is where mine runs, steady as a rock.
As to smelling exhaust, many leaks you can pick up with your ear when it's idling. Just listen from front to back to see if you can hear where it's leaking. Also, look at the exhaust manifold to cylinder head connection for black soot to see if the gasket is leaking. And if it's a 4Runner (you didn't say pickup or 4Runner), you'll smell exhaust if the back window is open or leaking a lot of air.
You said "chugs gas" -- what kind of mileage are you getting? I get about 16MPH in mostly city driving in my '87 22RE with EFI.
As to smelling exhaust, many leaks you can pick up with your ear when it's idling. Just listen from front to back to see if you can hear where it's leaking. Also, look at the exhaust manifold to cylinder head connection for black soot to see if the gasket is leaking. And if it's a 4Runner (you didn't say pickup or 4Runner), you'll smell exhaust if the back window is open or leaking a lot of air.
You said "chugs gas" -- what kind of mileage are you getting? I get about 16MPH in mostly city driving in my '87 22RE with EFI.
When idling, I've stuck my head in all over the engine bay and have not smelled any gas from that area. I replaced the exhaust manifold gasket yesterday and the old one wasn't very worn. The problem was still present. After a test drive, I drove by my friend and he told me he smelled excess gas/exhaust as I drove by. The only reason why I feel like I'm running rich is due to the overt gas smell coming from the exhaust pipe. This happens more when accelerating, as I goosed it when I drove by him. I suspect a bad fuel/air mix and don't know how to go about diagnosing where the problem originates, whether MAF sensor, injectors, O2 sensor, or other things. What do you think?
09-13-2020, 11:08 AM
#7
Registered User
IF it were me, I would test the resistance of the throttle body according to the FSM. AND the MAF. And the O2 sensor. And the temperature sensor that feeds the ECM. And the grounds. All of them, including the ones that are under the two kick panels in the passenger compartment. I would focus on the temperature sensor, and throttle body first, then all the rest.
Bear in mind, if you go to replace the temp sensor, don't put any teflon tape, or anything else, on the threads to stop leaks. Clean the threads it screws into very thoroughly before you put it in, if you replace it. It needs the contact with the metal to provide it's ground correctly. With that in mind, the ground to the head, engine block, and so on, are very important to make good circuits, thus allowing the ECM to sense the temp correctly, setting the mixture properly.
I would also check to see if the cold start injector might be leaking. If it's letting extra fuel in, bingo, it runs rich. Get some, like in several, of the crush washers used on the CSI before you pull it it check for leakage. You can't re-use them. If you pull the CSI, you'll need two, at least. As soon as you go to put a new one on, if you only have the one, it will jump off and disappear into the grass, never to be seen again. Every time.
You can check the plugs to see if they have heavy carbon build-up. That will tell you if it's actually running rich, or if it's an exhaust leak.
I've had the muffler replaced twice now for a crack in it where the pipe enters it, that made it sound really nice, but leaked exhaust into the cab. I know, they're not known for super custom work, but my thanks to the Midas lifetime warranty. They ran my entire exhaust line, engine to tail pipe, for any other leaks, but found none. It actually runs better now that the exhaust system has the right flow, and pressures in it.
As was mentioned, if the back window is down too far, like anything more than a couple inches, you will smell fuel when accelerating hard. Something to think about.
Good luck, and keep us up on what happens
Pat☺
Bear in mind, if you go to replace the temp sensor, don't put any teflon tape, or anything else, on the threads to stop leaks. Clean the threads it screws into very thoroughly before you put it in, if you replace it. It needs the contact with the metal to provide it's ground correctly. With that in mind, the ground to the head, engine block, and so on, are very important to make good circuits, thus allowing the ECM to sense the temp correctly, setting the mixture properly.
I would also check to see if the cold start injector might be leaking. If it's letting extra fuel in, bingo, it runs rich. Get some, like in several, of the crush washers used on the CSI before you pull it it check for leakage. You can't re-use them. If you pull the CSI, you'll need two, at least. As soon as you go to put a new one on, if you only have the one, it will jump off and disappear into the grass, never to be seen again. Every time.
You can check the plugs to see if they have heavy carbon build-up. That will tell you if it's actually running rich, or if it's an exhaust leak.
I've had the muffler replaced twice now for a crack in it where the pipe enters it, that made it sound really nice, but leaked exhaust into the cab. I know, they're not known for super custom work, but my thanks to the Midas lifetime warranty. They ran my entire exhaust line, engine to tail pipe, for any other leaks, but found none. It actually runs better now that the exhaust system has the right flow, and pressures in it.
As was mentioned, if the back window is down too far, like anything more than a couple inches, you will smell fuel when accelerating hard. Something to think about.
Good luck, and keep us up on what happens
Pat☺
Trending Topics
09-13-2020, 12:37 PM
#8
IF it were me, I would test the resistance of the throttle body according to the FSM. AND the MAF. And the O2 sensor. And the temperature sensor that feeds the ECM. And the grounds. All of them, including the ones that are under the two kick panels in the passenger compartment. I would focus on the temperature sensor, and throttle body first, then all the rest.
Bear in mind, if you go to replace the temp sensor, don't put any teflon tape, or anything else, on the threads to stop leaks. Clean the threads it screws into very thoroughly before you put it in, if you replace it. It needs the contact with the metal to provide it's ground correctly. With that in mind, the ground to the head, engine block, and so on, are very important to make good circuits, thus allowing the ECM to sense the temp correctly, setting the mixture properly.
I would also check to see if the cold start injector might be leaking. If it's letting extra fuel in, bingo, it runs rich. Get some, like in several, of the crush washers used on the CSI before you pull it it check for leakage. You can't re-use them. If you pull the CSI, you'll need two, at least. As soon as you go to put a new one on, if you only have the one, it will jump off and disappear into the grass, never to be seen again. Every time.
You can check the plugs to see if they have heavy carbon build-up. That will tell you if it's actually running rich, or if it's an exhaust leak.
I've had the muffler replaced twice now for a crack in it where the pipe enters it, that made it sound really nice, but leaked exhaust into the cab. I know, they're not known for super custom work, but my thanks to the Midas lifetime warranty. They ran my entire exhaust line, engine to tail pipe, for any other leaks, but found none. It actually runs better now that the exhaust system has the right flow, and pressures in it.
As was mentioned, if the back window is down too far, like anything more than a couple inches, you will smell fuel when accelerating hard. Something to think about.
Good luck, and keep us up on what happens
Pat☺
Bear in mind, if you go to replace the temp sensor, don't put any teflon tape, or anything else, on the threads to stop leaks. Clean the threads it screws into very thoroughly before you put it in, if you replace it. It needs the contact with the metal to provide it's ground correctly. With that in mind, the ground to the head, engine block, and so on, are very important to make good circuits, thus allowing the ECM to sense the temp correctly, setting the mixture properly.
I would also check to see if the cold start injector might be leaking. If it's letting extra fuel in, bingo, it runs rich. Get some, like in several, of the crush washers used on the CSI before you pull it it check for leakage. You can't re-use them. If you pull the CSI, you'll need two, at least. As soon as you go to put a new one on, if you only have the one, it will jump off and disappear into the grass, never to be seen again. Every time.
You can check the plugs to see if they have heavy carbon build-up. That will tell you if it's actually running rich, or if it's an exhaust leak.
I've had the muffler replaced twice now for a crack in it where the pipe enters it, that made it sound really nice, but leaked exhaust into the cab. I know, they're not known for super custom work, but my thanks to the Midas lifetime warranty. They ran my entire exhaust line, engine to tail pipe, for any other leaks, but found none. It actually runs better now that the exhaust system has the right flow, and pressures in it.
As was mentioned, if the back window is down too far, like anything more than a couple inches, you will smell fuel when accelerating hard. Something to think about.
Good luck, and keep us up on what happens
Pat☺
I will follow your advice step-by-step and get back to you all on this matter. I bought this truck from somebody who title jumped me and apparently did not care about SMOG, just selling the vehicle. Therefore, it would make sense for dirty or incorrect grounds and shoddy electrical work. After that, I'll search everything for leaks and find out if anything need be replaced.
Once again, you all rock.
The following users liked this post:
RAD4Runner (09-14-2020)
09-13-2020, 04:05 PM
#9
Hello all, I recently picked up an '85 pickup and she's just being broken in at 182,000 miles. The engine runs well and nothing is overtly wrong besides what I assume to be a loose timing chain tick.
However, the temperature gauge only reaches about 15% of the way up even after an hour on the highway. I smell exhaust and assume that the engine is running rich. She chugs gas - may be the fact that I'm new to manual transmissions - but I do smell exhaust inside the cab when I come to a stop.
I am a novice and would appreciate any knowledge on this matter. Could these two issues be connected? If so, what do I do about the low operating temp on the engine?
Thank you
However, the temperature gauge only reaches about 15% of the way up even after an hour on the highway. I smell exhaust and assume that the engine is running rich. She chugs gas - may be the fact that I'm new to manual transmissions - but I do smell exhaust inside the cab when I come to a stop.
I am a novice and would appreciate any knowledge on this matter. Could these two issues be connected? If so, what do I do about the low operating temp on the engine?
Thank you
Measure VTA voltage at the ECU with the throttle closed and engine off, compare this with the voltage with the throttle to the floor. Idle should be close to zero, but atleast less than 1v. Full throttle should be close to 5v, but not less than 4v. Now slowly move the throttle from closed open and you should see a smooth curve as voltage increased and never stops out.
You can do a similar check on the VAFM (from memory this might be a 0-12v sweep).
You can do these checks on the ohms setting but I find the voltage check to be simpler since you can do it without unplugging anything by back probing the ECU connector which means your not working about how good of a connection you got on the plugs.
The other thing to do is use an analog meter and check the VF signal from the oxygen sensor and look for the swing between rich and lean several times per second.
The two most important grounds are the EFI ground at the lower intake (This goes to the ECU), and the block ground (big wire from battery to block) are both clean and tight with bright bare metal showing.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
